Team Scam Open Discussion

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Got something to say about Team Scam?  Feel free to post it in the comment section below…

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Team Scam

Posted by Team Scam on January 29, 2011 in Team Scam.

193 Responses to “Team Scam Open Discussion”
  1. Izzy Says:

    This is an excellent idea, maybe have people give anonymously their TEAM stories and an open discussions section where we can ask questions, answer them, and discuss specific issues.

  2. team deception Says:

    We need a “how Orrin Woodward scams and deceives” article to post on.

    As you know Orrin Woodward, Tim Marks, Jim Martin, and Chris Brady, have all left the Flint area and have disbursed themselves throughout the US. Even though they have left the area their tactics are still the same. In the mid 2000’s Orrin Woodward found a church that had about 250 people in it and to him those people were just easy prey for him and his leaders to scam. While most people with any brains at all see Orrin and the TEAM for what they truly are, somehow there are still a handful of people who are blinded by their leadership scam and the dream of becoming rich. Now that Orrin has saturated this area and now that people have started calling him out for his scam he has packed up and left for Palm City Florida. Why is this relevant? Because his tactics are the same!!! New city and new church same ole scam artist. Orrin has been at this church for only months now and the new pastor has already been sucked into his money driven scam. Orrin Woodward is speaking at a conference Feb 25-26th called the CrossLife Conference: http://crosschurch.net/crosslife-conference-who-do-you-say-that-i-am/ He is one of five speakers. His topic to speak on is “He (God not Orrin) is the light of the world”. This church needs to be warned ASAP about what Orrin Woodward is really all about!!!! He will get his foot in the door and show people how awesome it is to be as rich as he is like only a narcissistic ego maniac could. He will work that church over like he did to the other one and then move on once the people realize what he is all about leaving them broke and with a garage full of product. These people at the new church have no idea what is getting ready to happen to them!!

    What can we do to help this church?

    Knowing Tim Marks, Jim Martin, and Chris Brady I doubt that they even go to church now but if they do I want to find those churches and warn them as well

  3. cultastic Says:

    I am really confused about all the team Life (living intentionally for excellence) talk going on the past few weeks since the last major. How does this change things for the average ibo with Team Monavie? Are they focusing on a team specific mlm that peddles straight leadership cds and books now? or are they still going t0 sucker people into paying $40 buck for a bottle of Juicy Fruit? anyone have any news or updates on this new scam?

  4. team deception Says:

    cultastic, the latest rumors out there have the TEAM moving away from the super juice and concentrating on the tools and leadership end of the scam: http://amthrax.wordpress.com/2011/01/13/rumor-team-becoming-less-product-focused/

    speaking on leadership I saw this quote on amthrax about one of the leaders of Team, the one and only Tim Marks:

    “Wow, so what did Tim Marks do exactly? He hid 17,000+ documents from Quixtars lawyers during the time of ‘Discovery,’ or what exactly does that refer too?

    You can’t get more dis-honest than that. The more I learn the more disgusted I get at this group of so called leaders.”

  5. Izzy Says:

    I would like to see individual stories as topics (example, “Izzy’s Story” and “Team Deception’s Story” that sort of thing what do you guys think? We don’t have to give names or specifics, but just general stuff. We’d have to contact the admin, though, but wondering if it would be an idea that you guys are okay with, is all.

  6. cultastic Says:

    Here is a recent comment over at Amthrax’s site

    “All members at Tom Ascol’s Grace Baptist church in Cape Coral, FL. and Steve Camp’s the Cross Church in Palm Springs, FL need to BEWARE the wolves in sheep’s clothing!!!
    I truly hope that these pastors wise up and start to question the diamonds motives here. The diamonds have everything to gain and these pastors stand to lose alot as people in their churches will be harmed.”

    Words cannot express how much I agree with this quote. The church is not a place that you want to toy with. The Lord will not look favorably on those who mess with his church. I hope the pastors and members at these churches head this warning.

  7. MadScientistMatt Says:

    I read the Amthrax post, and I’m wondering how they would be able to make it if they detached the TEAM pyramid from the MonaVie pyramid. It’s hard to see how they’d be able to sell a “business opportunity” without some sort of product that seems viable (at least to a very casual observer). So I guess they’d plan on selling the sales tools – but to whom? They’re not something the general public has any interest in, unlike health products or other typical MLM products.

    A corporate sales force seems an unlikely target for an MLM. Sure, they would have actual sales skills, but they get their sales training and tools from their employer, and they probably wouldn’t be impressed with TEAM tools. Small business owners might be a target, but they’ve already got their own business to grow – and if the business is any good whatsoever, Orrin runs the risk they’ll still keep their main focus on it and not dedicate enough effort to TEAM. So, it really seems their only viable target market is MLM people – or maybe very inept business owners.

    Could be they’re thinking of targeting sellers in other MLMs too. Anything else sounds like they’re building a pyramid in the air, which is even tougher than a castle in the air.

  8. team deception Says:

    Izzy, I love the idea. Lets get that ball rolling.

  9. cultastic Says:

    Orrin Woodward’s Team MonaVie Life Training (whatever he calls it these days)…is crashing down.

    Many high level leaders are speaking out and sharing their stories at Amthrax on how they were LIED to, MIS-LEAD, and taken advantage of.

    There have been over 450 comments left on one of the ex-Team members speak out article. DO NOT MISS OUT ON WATCHING THE SHIP SINK!!!! Go read the stories now, pretty painful…yet pretty exhilarating at the same time. (People are starting to recover, heal and moving on with their lives, which is great to see). By God’s Mercy and Grace this scam will come to an end!!!

  10. CULTASTIC_life training orrin woodward and chris brady scam Says:

    Just read this comment over at Amthrax. Very disturbing. Orrin Woodward and Chris Brady need to have their heads examined and life training team monavie business shut down, like, yesterday………

    When our income dropped to under $1,000, for six months, we were not in mv…. nothing. Yet the Team where OUR BIGGEST CHECK CAME FROM, apparently decided they didn’t have to pay certain people the money they owed them… ? WHile others got special deals it seems and were taken care of….. people that had smaller teams, system counts,tools, tickets. An example that I know of is a couple you would know from cds,they were ROUND TABLE MEMBERS AND HAD A PROFIT SHARER (possibly several) MAKE THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS MORE THAN THEM!!!!!……people with SUBSTANTIALLY SMALLER GROUPS WERE GETTING PAID WAY MORE!!!! Some were given large system counts and tickets for profit sharing, by their PC to count for money. (people that are not in their mv team)…. also they were hand picked for speaking at seminars to earn more income …….while others with bigger teams and more numbers, that had spoke more, were starved financially……….ehtical huh…? So imagine going from @10,000 a month to under a @thousand for a family with children. And imagine that you put all that money back into your business and then your pay disappeared with no explaination. AND IMAGINE THAT YOUR DOWNLINE …. IT SEEMS WERE GETTING SPECIAL DEALS FROM POLICY COUNSEL???!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IN PROFIT SHARING!!! Imagine that your team was still buying tens of thousands of dollars in team tools and you still had most of the numbers ….. What did they do with the Money????????????????????? discuting to say the least. ILLEGAL, UNEHTICAL, IMORAL?????
    Then we got into mv. A whole nother story ……. the registration process forced upon us like others said was unethical to say the least….??? My upline pc, and now diamond and a few downline helped divide and corrupt my team on that one. Threats , stealing , harassment, you name it. I’ll have to tell that story later when my blood pressure comes down.
    OH DID I TELL YOU, AFTER TRYING TO HANG IN FOR MONTHS AFTER MY TEAM WAS DIVIDED BY THOSE PC AND NOW DIAMOND GENIUSES, I WAS SLANDERED IN SECRET MEETINGS ,BECAUSE I WAS FRIENDS WITH SOMEONE THAT LOOKED AT SOMETHING ELSE? ANOTHER INCOME FLOW WHEN THEY WERE GOING BROKE BECAUSE OF WHAT TEAM DID TO THEM TOO? AND ANOTHER FRIEND STILL INVOLVED WITH TEAM WAS TOLD THEY WERE IMPLICATED BECAUSE THEY WERE FRIENDS WITH US!!! WE WERE BROKE, AND WE DID NOTHING!!! WE WERE NOT IN ANY OTHER BUSINESS ….AND I WAS TOO SICK TO DEAL WITH IT. NO PHONE CALLS NOTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHEN PC WAS ASKED ABOUT ALL THIS AND QUESTIONED HE FINALLY ADMITTED THAT NO HE NEVER TALKED TO US, AFTER HIM AND HIS MINIONS HAD SPREAD A BUNCH OF LIES !!!!!
    OH THEN THEY TAKE AWAY THE LAST BIT OF TEAM MONEY BASED ON SLANDEROUS LIES IN A LETTER THAT WAS WRITTEN BY MY DOWNLINE. MY OWN FAMILY. (WHO ARE STILL WITH TEAM) THEY WERE SOLICITED TO WRITE THE LETTER BY THE PC MEMBER. SAID LETTER WAS USED TO STEAL MY SECOND TEAM OUT OF PROFIT SHARING AND GIVE TO MY UPLINE WHO WAS ALREADY GETTING CREDIT FOR IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHO THEN COUNTED IT IN HIS OTHER LEG, TO GET MORE MONEY!!!! AND YEP YOU’VE SEEN HIM ON STAGE!!!! A DIAMOND NOW… ORRIN HIMSELF APPROVED OF THIS AND SAID “YOU DON’T OWN YOUR CUSTOMERS, WHO OWNS YOU”…!!!!!!!! HE THEN TRIED TO GIVE US THE GUILT TRIP BASED ON” HONOR AND CLASS, THAT WE COULD BE SOMEDAY” HE SAID HE TRIED TO CALL….LIES…., BECAUSE AFTER ALL OF THIS SHIT HAPPENED WE TRIED TO BUILD OUR MV BUSINESS AND SAVE WHAT WAS LEFT OF OUR TEAM, THAT OUR GREAT UPLINE PC AND OTHERS HAD IRREVERSIBLE DAMAGED!!!!!!! BUT HE WAS DISAPPOINTED BECAUSE WE FOUND INFORMATION AND HELP FROM PEOPLE IN ANOTHER SYSTEM, BECAUSE WE HAD NO CHOICE!!!!!!!!!!!! WE COULD NO LONGER FOLLOW CORUPTION AND LIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    TO TOP IT ALL OFF, WE HAVE BEEN SLANDERED AND LIED ABOUT IN OUR SMALL TOWN, BY OUR OWN DOWNLINE ( WHO DID NOT CALL US) WHO WE SPENT AT LEAST 3 YEARS BUILDING THEIR BUSINESS AND ANOTHER 3 SUPPORTING IT !!!!!! WHOM I LEVERAGED IN WITH 9+ PEOPLE,WHO NOW SAY SOMEONE ELSE IS THERE SPONSOR….WHEN THEY SPEAK ON A TEAM STAGE. YEP BUILT BOTH LEGS TO SILVERS SO THEY COULD ALL GO PLATNIM, AND A THIRD. LEFT Q AS A SAPPHIRE/ ROUND TABLE LEVEL AND HAD TWO -THREE PLATNIMS IN ONE LEG, A COUPLE IN PLATNIM QUALIFICATION IN ANOTHER LEG AND OUR THIRD TEAM AT @4500 PV.., AND THEN MISSED RUBY BY ONE CASE A FEW MONTHS AFTER GETTING IN MV… …. NONE OF MY DOWNLINE WERE EVEN CLOSE. BUT NOW YOU WOULD DEFINATELY KNOW WHO THEY ARE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IN ONE YEAR MY UPLINE PC AND OTHERS SYSTEMATICALLY DESTROYED MY BUSINESS. MY PC DESTROYED MY CREDIBILITY BY PUSHING ME OUT OF SPEAKING, LETTING MY DOWNLINE WITH NOT EVEN CLOSE TO THE SAME PIN OR EXPERIENCE, TAKE OVER, AT THE OPENS I BUILT FOR 6 YEARS. THEY DESTROYED MY REPUTATION, FINANCES, RELATIONSHIPS, GOOD FREINDSHIPS, AND MY TEAM!!! 6 YEARS OF WORK,LEAVING MY KIDS NIGHT AFTER NIGHT……DESTROYED FOR GREED AND POWER!!!!!!! NOW WE ARE FINANCIALLY JUST SCRAPING BY BECAUSE OF OUR LEFT OVER MV INCOME, (most of our team quit because of all this crap) MY HEALTH HAS BEEN DESTROYED AND MY HUSBAND IS MAKING A THIRD OF WHAT HE MADE AT HIS JOB BEFORE TEAM. WE HAVE BEEN DESTROYED AND MY HEALTH CANNOT TAKE ANYMORE!!!
    BUT I CAN NO LONGER BE OPPRESSED AT THE INJUSTICES AND IMMORAL PRACTICES THAT THE TEAM USES!!!!!!!!!!!!
    P.S. I HOPE OTHERS CAN SHARE THE TRUTH, AS IT IS VERY HEALING.

  11. CULTASTIC_life training orrin woodward and chris brady scam Says:

    Amthrax is on FIRE!!! Lots of good stories over there. We need to heat this blog up as well.

  12. team deception - Life Training Orrin Woodward Says:

    “No one can make you feel inferior without your consent”

    “Your life does not get better by chance, it gets better by change”

    “Nine tenths of education is encouragement”

    “No harm in putting all your eggs in one basket – just watch it closely”

    “Punctuality is the expression of commitment”

    “We are born naked, wet, and hungry, and get slapped on our butt … then things get worse”

    Who’s fired up?!?!?!?!?!? After reading these one liners I know the TEAM is ready to chase after the dream now!!!! Are you ready to lose all your friends and family and go into debt?!?!?!??!

    Would it disappoint you TEAMbots that these quotes are not from your fearless leader Orrin Woodward but instead are from fortune cookies at a local Chinese restaurant?

  13. CULTASTIC_life training orrin woodward and chris brady scam Says:
  14. Former Gold Says:

    Just thought I would pop over to the Team site…..nothing to be seen of MV…..

    Things that make you go hmmmmm

  15. CULTASTIC_life training orrin woodward and chris brady scam Says:

    This letter to Orrin appeared over on Amthrax. Very interesting questions raised. Orrin where art thou?

    Dear Orrin,
    Everyone knows Monavie is broken.
    The numbers have been in decline for years now. Maybe that is why there has not been an updated income disclosure statement since 2009?
    I have a question for you. Maybe a few.
    First…
    We all know you are looking to start a new business venture called L.I.F.E (Lies Inspiring Feeble Endeavors?). Yet, currently you are on stage promoting Monavie as the financial answer to all of their economic problems and Dallin Larsen as if he is the Messiah (mormon, mind you).
    My question is this…
    Where is the ethics in this?
    I am sure you are promoting L.I.F.E to all of your leaders and counting the days this summer to when you launch your new business.
    What about all of the current distributors that you are signing up and telling them to buy loads of product and tools for this business. Are they not wasting their money?
    These people will be stuck with worthless tools as they were when you pulled this same TACTIC switching from Amway to Quixtar, Quixtar to Team of Destiny, Team of Destiny to Team and Team to Monavie.
    SSDD.
    Remember getting on stage in June 2007 and firing the crowd up about Quixtar (yes there were lots of new faces in the crowd that month)?
    Remember telling those new faces that QUIXTAR was THEE business and that you were all going to a million people then?
    Did you happen to tell those new faces that you were going to SUE Quixtar the next month in August of 2007?
    Why not?
    Isn’t that ethically wrong?
    I feel like you are doing this all over again with Monavie, are you not?
    Moving along….
    You are the GRAND WIZARD, correct? The business, errr your business, is indeed built around YOU and not a product or company, right? That is after all the only way that your ego could take it, right? I mean, God forbid if someone tells YOU what to do. I mean….that is after all why YOU left Amway is it not? Because you could not stand being told what to do? You did not like their rules? I mean it seems so obvious now. You can make rules for everyone else but yourself. What makes you so special? Did you at least get permission from Chris Brady before suing Amway? I mean…we all know that he is the true brain child behind team. Not only does he have some what better looks than you, and let’s face it…WAY BETTER SPEAKING SKILLS and HUMOR than you, but he also more common sense and smarts than you, doesn’t he?
    Back on topic…
    Since you are starting a new LIFE training business, is it safe to say that Monavie is a sinking ship? You wouldn’t need to start a new venture if you guys were making money with Monavie, right?
    Didn’t you do an in-depth bench marking study back in the winter of 2008 analyzing Monavie? I think you did. This is where you confirmed that Monavie was the best option for team and all distributors who left Amway? Yes, it was. That is really interesting.
    You didn’t do a benchmarking study did you? You just looked at who was paying you the most cash to bring your business over to them, right?
    Thought so.
    ….
    Another question that comes to mind…
    If you want to start the Life Training scam, why are you waiting till this summer to launch? Is it possible that you are still paying Dallin Larsen off since he was the one to bankroll your lawsuits with Amway? Isn’t that what happened? People are wondering why Dallin is selling you book ‘Launching a Leadership Revolution,’ so that he can keep the markup profit to help pay down your debt? So, you do owe Dallin Larsen money then? And everyone else in your business that is still building Monavie for a few months until the new LIFE business takes off is staying in just to pay down your debt? Do they know this? Seems like something you should tell your distributors. I would not want to be mis-lead like this. But wait…that is your specialty after all, right? Orrin Woodward the great mis-leader!?
    Let’s go back to the lawsuit for a moment.
    You were a small little thorn stuck up Amway’s…well, you were a pain anyways. But we all know that you could not afford to play with the REAL big boys in court. Amway would have destroyed you financially. So it is true that Monavie and Dallin was your sugar daddy during the law suits, right? It is starting to make sense now why you are partnered up with Monavie in the first place.
    Let’s change topics.
    How about Results?
    Or your lack of results?
    You are lacking results in Monavie, right?
    Brigg Hart seems to be the real player and shining star in Monavie. How come you can’t keep up with the big boys?
    From what I can tell, Brigg Hart is hitting bigger and better levels and you have stayed the same (or at least been faking it for a few years). We haven’t seen you hit any new levels and all you do is talk about others hitting results.
    You went Black Diamond Presidential mumbo jumbo when you came over from Amway, but have you done anything since? All you did was prove that you could hit a level with your pre-established business. Has anyone in your downline gone Diamond organically (i.e – without bringing over numbers from a pre-established business)? Didn’t think so.
    So, where are the results? How come Brigg Hart is kicking your butt? Don’t you want to be a BIG BOY and run with the big dogs?
    How come you are camping out at black diamond? Are you a CAMPER?
    Orrin is a CAMPER!!!! I knew it. Even a MANAGER. That is another good description for you.
    Orrin the CAMPING MANAGER!!! haha This is great. And I thought you were going to a million.
    Brigg Hart is a trekker and has a WAY BIGGER business. Crazy! I never thought you would be one to settle for less.
    So, where are your results? Are you really a black diamond? Maybe you should come out on stage and tell people your true PIN. You are in fact an Emerald, are you not? If so, you should be up front with people and honest. It would not be good to lie and pretend to be something bigger than you are.
    PRETENDER. lol
    Orrin is a pretender.
    No?
    Prove me wrong.
    So, where are your results? Still no results.
    Maybe it is because you are only good at scamming people, right? You only have results at scamming people in an MLM. I have heard you tout on stage that you are some financial guru that has lots of extra cash to play in the ‘I’ quadrant and invest money. You brag of being the guy to come to for advice on what to do with your money when others reach your level so that they too can invest their cash in outside businesses….
    ….Question…
    Name one outside success you have had in your life outside of Team/Monavie?
    You can’t can you?
    I have heard sooooooooo many FAILURES on your part and investments gone bad. You are the last guy I would trust with my money or ask for advice. You know why? Because I would never ask a CAMPING MANAGER for financial advice. PERIOD! Especially one who lacks the results.
    Another topic for discussion.
    Show me one person outside of the MLM industry that agrees that you are ranked #7 in the world as a ‘Top Leadership Guru.’ I would love to see who you find that believes this bundle of laughs. More like #7 in the world in Top Ranked ‘CAMPING MANAGERS.’ lol

  16. Amthrax Says:

    I posted an article explaining how TEAM builds its business through an approach called Sling, Squeeze and Side Action.

  17. Amthrax Says:

    Today, I have an article explaining how one profits from the sales of tools and function tickets in TEAM.

  18. MegaVie Says:

    I have to share these fantastic motivational quotes from my friends in TEAM. They really pump you up to sell fruit juice!

    “You are never going to read a biography about a coward, you are never going to see a statue erected to a critic, you are never going to find a town named after someone who stayed at home, watched TV and played it safe.”
    -Chris Brady (Launching a Leadership Revolution)

    Those who sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither. ~Benjamin Franklin

    Small minds talk about people.
    Medium minds talk about events.
    Great minds talk about vision. ~George Guzzardo

    “You miss 100 percent of the shots you don’t take.” ~Wayne Gretzky

    “Bad information is free and readily available, good information is rare and costs money.” – Orrin Woodward

    “There is no safety in a significant life, and there is no significance in a safe life.” -Chris Brady

    “One doesn’t always get what one wants, and one doesn’t always get what one deserves, but one does generally get what one pictures.” – Orrin Woodward

    “God believes in charity but not welfare.” – Orrin Woodward

    “The laws of success are cold hearted, they don’t care about your excuses.”

    “Excuses are like belly buttons. Everyone has one, it helped you for a little while, but now it’s useless.” -Jim Martin

    “The gap between your vision and your current reality is your hunger”

    Now don’t you all feel like winners??????

  19. Team Scam Says:

    Film critic Roger Ebert has a star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame as well as well as three honorary degrees. It’s not a statue, but it’s a lot more than I’ve seen from any juice salesman.

    I guarantee you that Orrin Woodward hasn’t sold a piece of information to the general public that wasn’t available for free.

  20. TONI Says:

    The TEAM have many different people out there selling for them and doing their bidding, if you do a criminal background check on some you might find they have been arrested for & convicted for various crimes one of their mid level managers I know for a fact is not a Christian but will say he his while having sex in public with married women & was arrested for it.So how many others on this way of life lie cheat & steal their way to the top…..I will be forwarding on the appropriate information as well to other posts & even the news media in hopes that it might stop a few good people going into the TEAM direction.

  21. dudewheresmycar Says:

    It makes me sick how people can say so much bad stuff about a person. I’m not sticking up for Orrin but at the same time I’m not bad mouthing him it just up sets me that so many people have so much bad stuff to say! its depressing!!!how do you expect to be happy when you cant say any thing nice!!! I thought there were nice people in this world but this site just proves me wrong!!!!!!!

  22. Team Scam Says:

    dudewheresmycar,

    Should those who study World War II sing the praises of Hitler? Or should they just tell it like it is? I think it is best to tell it like it is as it helps people make an educated decision about whether they want to get involved in such an organization.

    I’m sorry that you believe that there are no longer any nice people in the world because this website exists. I thought all people had the ability to reason with logic, but your comment has proved me wrong.

  23. Speak Your Truth Says:

    dudewheresmycar~
    You know what makes me sick, is when someone like you who comes here by choice and then tells people who have LIVED & EXPERIENCED the corruption and tell us you are depressed!
    Why not go to the Team blogs and read the ‘happy’ fake propaganda, out of all those websites you choose this one?
    You are sticking up for Orrin, who do you think you are kidding?
    Don’t ‘judge’ our ‘niceness’ by us telling the truth.
    Should we praise and talk nice about Bernie Madoff, would that keep you in your delusional ‘happy’ state?
    Try walking in our shoes and think for yourself, then you could be true to yourself and find happiness all on your own.

  24. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Megavie~
    Nice try but give credit where credit is due,those aren’t ‘their quotes’ but hey thanks we are pumped now with YOUR ‘motivational’ praising!

  25. krissy Says:

    The so called “Team” has hit Northern California. I hear they were in San Diego also. Targeting young adults. 20 year old kids. And I will be spreading the word against this pyramid scheme. I had a hunch it was a scam. I was right.
    So I will let the authorities know they are trying to build a pyramid in our community. These people should leave innocent people alone, and quit trying to use this con. I don’t buy their nonsense!

  26. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Krissy~
    I commend you for your courage and standing up to this farce.

  27. carlos Says:

    If you are the type of people that believe everything they read on the internet then you are flat out dumb.
    Say TEAM was a scam (which isn’t) even if it was a scam at least it is a scam that got my cousin of of drugs, at least it is a scam that strengthened my uncles marriage, at least it is a scam that got me to talk in front of a bunch of people which i would peed my pants if i was ever even in front of that many people. at least it is a scam where it got my friend off of depression and suicidal thoughts. I CAN SAY I BELIEVE IN GOD BUT SOMEONE ELSE CAN GO ON THE INTERNET AND SAY HEY LOOK IT SAYS HERE THAT GOD ISN’T REAL SO I’M GOING TO CHOOSE TO BELIEVE THAT ONE THING

  28. Abbott Says:

    I am a TEAM survivor as well, I was involved for about 6 months in the northern IL/southern WI area. I did everything they told me to do from one major to the next (Columbus in January ’11 to Milwaukee in April ’11) including going to open meetings, Saturday seminars, one-on-one’s, house plans, business launches… I always had doubts in my mind but I figured I would at least give it shot. Honestly, for the people who are pouring their life savings into it year after year, they deserve what they’re going to get out of it for better or for worse. I could say a lot about the time and money I threw away on it, but that isn’t why I really think it’s a scam. The last straw for me was at the Milwaukee major when I heard Tim Marks stand on stage in front of 10,000 people and blatantly say that Christianity is “the best religion.” My jaw dropped to hear someone say something so ignorant and embarrassing, but when I looked around me, NOT A SINGLE PERSON IN THE AUDIENCE SEEMED TO BE UPSET. Something similar happened that night when George Guzzardo gave a speech about absolute truths and “science without morality.” It made me sad and extremely disappointed to see such a huge group of people following a few rich men like sheep. Any organization of that size needs to have at least a few people who can think outside the box, ask questions and raise eyebrows at some things… when no one dares to question the leadership, that is a huge, HUGE problem. That was basically the end of my time in TEAM.

  29. Team Scam Says:

    Carlos,

    Just because it is on the Internet doesn’t mean it’s wrong. Since you wrote on the Internet that Team is not scam, perhaps we shouldn’t believe that either. This is especially true considering: According to Forbes, Team is a Pyramid Scheme. You don’t need to trust me, just trust Forbes – it’s printed on paper and trusted my millions and millions.

    Team also breaks up marriages. I’ve had numerous people say such things at MonaVie Scam.

    You shouldn’t bring your theological beliefs into these discussions. Team isn’t a religion. If it were, it would be a cult.

  30. Mike Says:

    How hiarious it is to see how many people are corrupted by this sites bs. To critisize the things i see working everyday, how amusing the lies you all tell based on what you have read and not exprienced. Enjoy your thinking, your scam posts and the non-existant retirement you hope for. Ill enjoy living intentionally for excellence. Ill enjoy life, and the team.

  31. James Miller, Toronto ON Says:

    Cultastic…. Team deception… Izzy… so many angry bitter comments with no true names or faces.
    It’s so easy to sound informed when you can make any fact up to benefit your argument.
    Have some guts. Post your real names or email addresses. If you are so passionate about proving that these guys are truly scamming people then be proud and show yourself.
    Oh wait… that would be something you wouldn’t have the courage to do, clearly. But oddly men like Orrin and the rest of the Team leaders would be happy to go head to head in a debate with any of you. Who’s scamming who?
    Don’t be so bitter just because you didn’t believe in yourself enough to get the success in life you were after. Leave those with a dream alone and be happy in your working class lifestyle. Success clearly wasn’t something you could handle.

  32. Team Scam Says:

    It is hilarious to see Mike defending it, considering that Forbes called it a pyramid scheme. And Mike, I’ve been essentially retired at 33. Thanks for asking.

  33. Team Scam Says:

    James Miller,

    I’m the person who runs LazyManAndMoney.com. I’m not hiding. I don’t give my name because I often post all my financial information. It’s very common for people who open up their financial books to the world to not include their name. I’m much more open than you are with hundreds of posts proving it. If you want to post all your financial information, be my guest.

    As for Orrin and the rest of the Team leaders being happy to go head to head in a debate with me. Let’s go. I challenge them. I’ve laid down the gauntlet here: http://www.lazymanandmoney.com/orrin-woodward-scams-monavie-team-lies/.

    Don’t be claiming that I’m a dream stealer. That’s oldest MLM trick in the book.

  34. webelieved Says:

    James-
    Wow I think you need to go back and read How to Win Friends and Influence People. You clearly haven’t studied enough with Team, and you do not follow the Team system. Remember only positive. You are too negative to make it in Team.
    But you definitly speak the same old rhetoric.I am suprised Owen doesn’t teach you a new gig to say about critics. Same ol same ol. Maybe you are Owen trying to find out who he can sue? Pretty funny he sued Scott Larsen for being a critic and then later left Amway and agreed with all Scott had said. Hypocrite? Also Orrin was behind a few anonymous blogs, so pretty funny your leader doesn’t follow your ideals. Good luck with Team though. Let us know when you wake up and feel like a fool for following a crook. You clearly haven’t done your homework. I know you were told not to. All critics of Team are all losers who didn’t want to do the work right and don’t have a big enough dream? LOL
    P.S. I would rather be a working middle class and be proud of my integrity, then be rich by lying to people and stealing from people! Good luck explaining that one to the Almighty!

  35. Amthrax Says:

    @James Miller – You may want to head on over to my website, where there is an in-depth discussion pertaining to Orrin Woodward’s past anonymous blogging exploits, exploits which Orrin himself admitted to on his personal blog. Learn more here:

    http://amthrax.wordpress.com/2011/08/16/orrin-qrush-the-many-blogs-of-orrin-woodward-part-one/

    and

    http://amthrax.wordpress.com/2011/08/18/orrin-woodwards-five-principles-for-team-life/

  36. Jill Says:

    I am a TEAM survivor. I remember going to my first weekly meeting after having “The Plan” shown to me at my best friends house by her brother in law and sister. I remembered telling my friend in the meeting “I think this is a cult”. We laughed about it. My husband and I joined, I was much more comfortable with it then he was. He never felt like it was an ethical business. Anyway, after about six months and spending thousands of dollars trying to get to several functions be earning “PV”. After the Major in Lansing in January they then started to require that we buy certain products, like the gross energy drinks, in order to maintain your position and earn PV. That is when we decided it was costing us more money and we were getting nowhere. Our “team” was also starting to fall apart, because we all felt that our upline, who were our best friends and my husbands boss, were really becoming unethical. The company my husband worked for even did a whole investigation at the business because they knew about the TEAM and how unethical it was and decided that no one could discuss it or talk about during business hours. My husbands boss was busy doing TEAM business when he was supposed to be working. It was a mess. My husband was scared he was going to loose his job because he was part of this Scam!! This business ruined our friendship. I remember how appalled I was by them telling us we should only associate with other TEAM members, and to cut everyone else out of our lives. How ridiculous is that? THE TEAM IS A SCAM, BE AFRAID, BE VERY AFRAID!!!! Orrin Woodward, Chris Brady, Tim Marks are all crooks and should be locked up for ruining peoples lives and STEALING OTHER PEOPLE’S MONEY SO THEY CAN LIVE THE HIGH LIFE. AND BELIEVE ME THEY DO LIVE THE HIGH LIFE!

  37. Jesse Eugster Says:

    I would just like to point out that as a new team member I have already learned more about business management, marketing and investing than I did in two years of business education through a UW system’ and I haven’t spent a dime.
    I have been independantly trying to start an online business for several months now (not such an easy thing without direction) and have run into problems every step of the way. In the first five pages of the first book I was given I discovered my answer. I have learned that to have a successful business you need to establish LOYAL CLIENTELE. Now, how are you ever supposed to do that in an online setting? there is no auditory communication there, no sights, smells, or attitudes that will convince a person to return, there is only the product, the price, and the delivery. In this case, loyalty is decided by the lowest shipping cost. The person who can develop a loyal online community of customers (the entire basis of TEAM) will rule monetarily over the internet!
    To all of you critics out there (and there are lots) take into account the amount of knowledge there is to be had in this organization. Not only are you essentially GIVEN a business with a prescribed system (which works), but you are given a blueprint for building your own successful online business! Now that sounds like a lucrative preposition to me. I am not trying to convince you to share all of TEAM’s ideals, I just want you to realize the extreme potential of leveraging your knowledge to rise above an hourly wage and begin to live your life how you want to!
    Critics can and will argue against what i say until they develop pressure sores on their ass and their fingers are numb from carpel tunnel, but no matter what one’s view is on TEAM, one cannot argue that nothing at all can be lost by listening to economic superstars like Micheal Dell (Dell corporation for those who didn’t make the connection), a man who build one of the largest internet-based companies in the world over a very short span of time; and he started this business in his mother’s garage with little prior knowledge of business, or computing. To learn either directly or indirectly from someone who has had so much success cannot be a bad thing. Say what you will, but I am going to take the knowledge I will gain from this experience and build myself a business in which I need not intervene. Instead of trading time for money I will leverage my time and my knowledge to create a residual income, and hey, maybe I’ll buy a helicopter just to say I have one.

  38. Team Scam Says:

    I would point out that I learned more about all those in my blogging business and I didn’t have to spend a dime either. At some point you will.

    If you needed a book to tell you that you need to establish loyal clientele to have a successful business, well you need to hit the library. I’d also suggest that you visit: http://personalmba.com/.

    Be very careful with believing that you can’t establish loyalty online or that the answer is cheap shipping. I have a lot of loyal readers on other blogs and I don’t really ship them anything.

    The pitch about building your own successful online business is the stuff of late night TV, get rich quick schemes. It sounds like a scam.

    Michael Dell doesn’t support TEAM and is not related to TEAM in any way. You are not learning from Michael Dell when you sign up with TEAM.

  39. Samanth Says:

    Dear Jesse,

    You say you are a new team member. I was a team member for more than ten years; I was in before it was Team, even before it was Team of Destiny. I left before LIFE. Before you throw all in to the Team, please let me share some things with you:

    I agree that there is a wealth of wonderful information within the Team system. But please don’t be fooled–ALL of this information is available outside the Team system, and for lots cheaper. Within Team, you will pay full retail price for every book you purchase. The Team purchases these books for between 1/10 and 1/4 the retail prices, and the difference goes in to their “profit-sharing” pot. You can purchase any of these books (except the Team published ones) for way less almost anywhere else, and most are available at any library too.

    You said that “you are GIVEN a business with a prescribed system (which works)…” Oh my dear, you are GIVEN nothing. Please listen to me. Most MLMs have written Policies and Procedures that you agree to follow when you sign their registration form. Most Policies and Procedures include a clause that states “any and all policies can be changed at any time and for any reason.” Translated–you can follow the policies to the letter and still get tossed for any reason. Don’t believe me? Ask any attorney.

    But as for Team, they don’t even have written Policies and Procedures. In the past twelve years, less than one-half of one percent of the people who registered with Team/Team of Destiny/Life have made any income. A prescribed system which works? Hah!! If you are so fortunate as to actually achieve a level where you get paid from Team, please know that it is ONLY because someone (Orrin) decided you would get paid. If he decides not to pay you, (and believe me, that happens!) then you don’t get paid.

    Residual income?? Trust me kiddo, not in this game. There are many, many ways to build solid residual income in this country, but Team is not one of them. You will work your guts out for years, spend tens of thousands of dollars in materials, travel, seminars, etc., and you end up owning NOTHING! And once again, if you don’t believe me, ask any competent business attorney.

    I was one of the few who actually made a good amount of money through Team profit-sharing. We had a pretty nice lifestyle for a number of years. So why did we walk away? Once we realized that we did not have anything more than a monthly check that could stop at any moment, that we did NOT own or control ANYTHING, we decided that we could no longer stand on stage or sit in a living room and tell people that Team was a good deal. Was it hard to have to go back to work? Yes. But worth it.

  40. Jesse Eugster Says:

    Thank you for a couple of intelligent responses. Most of the rest of the comments on this blog were just childish. Team scam, I just want to say that I never said Micheal Dell was involved in Team, but he did create an online community and a loyal clientele on the internet, and the entire idea of Commerce through Community comes from his ideals not Orrin’s.

    I just want to follow in Dell’s shoes, I’m not throwing my heart and soul into Team, but I will use them to motivate me, and I will gain from the experience.

  41. Speak Your Truth Says:

    James Miller~ Thanks for the laughs.. :)

    You say:”It’s so easy to sound informed when you can make any fact up to benefit your argument.”

    How do you ‘make up any fact to benefit an argument?…That is hilarious.

    Jesse~

    Samantha is right and I will confirm that has been OUR experience in a lot of ways after more than a decade also. We speak because we care about others and wouldn’t want you or anyone else to live nor experience what we have.

    Good luck though, with all do respect you cannot honestly, you haven’t been warned.

  42. a regular guy Says:

    ok, so i am a part of this “scam” but do not plan on getting rich from this, it is an education program similar to college, but way cheaper and nothing is required. team is a company that teaches leadership skills, business concepts, psychology, relationship building, and of course community building. MonaVie is the first of many companies to be associated with team. it is a “fruity juice” with A LOT of value…$40 is a little steep for a bottle but if i could afford it i would have an endless supply…i took Active,(the one with glucosamine) for a while and it helped a great deal, it took about a month to really feel a difference. its no question that Acai is an amazing fruit and monavie has the best Acai. the Emv (enegy drink) is my favorite product, it is 100% natural and tastes better than any other energy drink or soda. the snack bars are another of my favorites because its very healthy and i think they taste great.

    Pyramid scheme?? the business structure is in the shape of a pyramid…but so is every business, corporation, and organization…oh and what about our nations currency…its worthless paper we got for giving our gold and silver to our government. which by the way it costs 1.79 cents to create a Pennie, Minting 3,487 million pennies in 2010 cost the US taxpayer $27.5 million in order to subsidize the existence of the penny.

    so with that said, team and monavie are not a scam, you just have to understand what exactly it is that EACH INDIVIDUAL business offers, which most people dont because of all the hype and bullshit from sites like this. if you go to a meeting and really listen to what it is they do, look past the money (although the money part works fairly well if thats what you want AND PUT THE EFFORT IN!!!!!!!!), they are far from a scam and have taught me a lot about business and people…far more than i learned in school.

  43. Team Scam Says:

    It is an education program similar to going to the library and reading books, but it much, much, more expensive. You can’t compare TEAM to a college education because the world doesn’t hire people based on the Team education. Most HR departments wouldn’t even know what you are talking about.

    MonaVie has very little value as proven in around 100 posts at: http://www.juicescam.com/.

    Please familiarize yourself with the definition of a pyramid scheme: http://business.ftc.gov/documents/inv08-bottom-line-about-multi-level-marketing-plans. It has nothing to do with the business structure shape.

    Your penny rant is unrelated to Team or MonaVie. That said, it is worth mentioning that the cost to retrofit computer software to eliminate the penny would be billions.

    You certainly didn’t learn much about business if you think there’s “A LOT of value” in the $40 bottle of MonaVie.

  44. a regular guy Says:

    you can get a college education at the library or on the internet too…the only difference is the diploma…i dont need someone else to tell me im educated or not, the important part is the education, not the $150,000 piece of paper, i have looked at the books and info they offer and they are the same price and cheaper in some cases than other sources. dont get me wrong, college is good (but way over priced) and honestly i dont plan on being an employee my whole life because, well, i dont want too because i know i can do something better (and its not get rich from team or monavie)for that $40 bottle that lasts roughly a week, your body cannot absorb anymore of the offered nutrients. the Acai berry kills 86% of cancer (the study was done at the University of florida (that would be a reputable college) http://news.ufl.edu/2006/01/12/berries/) and Monavie puts as much of that in your body as it can absorb.

    how about any of the other products…besides the $40 bottles that numerous professional athlete’s use…like most players on the Green Bay Packers (i think they did pretty good, not much into sports though). the Emv is the same if not cheaper than most energy drinks…my opinion is that it tastes better, and is 100% natural. the weight managment program i have not needed to use but i have seen people lose fair amounts of weight, and it tastes good.

    and really it will cost billions to not make something…really? they could just not make pennies….they are 2%-3% copper, and seriously, who the fuck wants pennies? (unless you are a collector because after they stop making them the value will go up)

  45. switch Says:

    “regular guy” says~
    “team is a company that teaches leadership skills, business concepts, psychology, relationship building, and of course community building.”

    ….since when on earth does team qualify to teach lessons in psychology? Do they all have qualifications to do so? Huh….must be something new.

    When does the lying and deception ever stop?!

  46. switch Says:

    What you really meant, regular guy was they offer friendly advice (which anyone can get off the street from a local bum) to everyone on the team and spin it in their direction like you did here, to make them look good. No?

  47. switch Says:

    regular guy says~
    “i dont need someone else to tell me im educated or not, the important part is the education, not the $150,000 piece of paper, i have looked at the books and info they offer and they are the same price and cheaper in some cases than other sources. dont get me wrong, college is good (but way over priced) and honestly i dont plan on being an employee my whole life because, well, i dont want too because i know i can do something better…”

    …oh really? Like what, peddling a fruit punch, and lying about all the illegal health claims and testimonies like you have here (where stating that “most GB Packers are using” it. And going on to state that they did by using the other products that they “pretty good”?)

    Hate to break it to ya but it has just a little more to do with a fruit punch/RVL weight loss product to be successful in the NFL. What about a players talent, and the coaching staff? I suppose that has nothing to do with it…and according to you just sip the juice and sparks will fly out your a$$ pretty much.

    So, in a nutshell that piece of paper that costs some people $150,000 is only a “piece of paper to you”? The education that they have means absolutely nothing? How the HELL do you know what their education is? What about all the surgeons and doctors who pay that much plus alot more to save lives everyday?

    What a degrading thing to say, mr. regular guy.

  48. a regular guy Says:

    If you read my first comment you would see that it started by me saying “ok, so i am a part of this “scam” but do not plan on getting rich from this, it is an education program similar to college,” so no, not by “peddling a fruit punch, and lying about all the illegal health claims and testimonies” where i the only health claim i made was the fact that the Acai berry kills 86% of cancer cells. Acai is an amazing friut and there is no arguing that. MonaVie has the most potent Acai product on the market, and it has a lot of other fruits are mixed with it. if you take the 2oz in morning and night it provides the maximum amount that you body can absorb. how is it an illegal health claim? i provided the link to the state university that conducted the study. it is also true that a lot of Packers drink the Active blend. and again i don’t really follow sports but i herd that they did pretty good this last year. and your right, it does take a lot more to be in the NFL, but do you think that they would waste their time and money on something that doesn’t help them, or do you think they take care of their body and actually notice a difference. yes players, talent, and coaching have more to do with a good team, i never said if you drink monavie you can play for the packers, thats ridiculous what i’m getting at is they take care of their body and want to be healthy…drinking it once wont do much, but if you drink it every day it has a very positive effect, i know this because after a month or so of continued regular use i did not have nearly as much pain in my lower back. and i think this is the illegal testimonial your talking about….its true, my back hurt less after continued use. so no, if you just sip the juice sparks will not fly out of anywhere…my claims where not even close to that.

    psychology is “the science of the mind or of mental states and processes. the science of human and animal behavior.” not a a degree, because a degree is just verification of knowledge, a bum on the street could go to the library and read the same books that you would read in a college. the only difference is you got that piece of paper that said you read the books (the qualifications you are talking about. there are many many parts to psychology and the team teaches certain parts of psychology, it is not the same as a psychology program from a college, it is focused on the parts of psychology that help you relate to people, understand them, build healthy relationships, and communicate effectively.

    your comparing apples to oranges. business, psychology vs human biology and anatomy. the team cannot teach you what you would learn in med school, college is not a bad place, its a good place, but seeing the business education provided by most schools and that of Team…well team has better education for me, for what my plans are, and for what i’m building. Team is like college in the way that they each compile information for you on business, marketing, leadership, and psychology.

    i just want to make it clear that the education the surgeons and doctors have does mean a lot…they do save lives, and in no way do i think that me learning from team can put me on their level of education…just like their med school wont put them on my level of education…2 completely different fields of study.

    and you tried to put a lot of words into my mouth, if you want a real discussion don’t do that.

  49. switch Says:

    LOL! Wow, what an education….”psychology isn’t a degree”.

    Here’s an interesting approach for ya~

    “http://www.oprah.com/health/The-Truth-About-Oprah-Dr-Oz-Acai-Resveratrol-and-Colon-Cleanse”

    I suppose you’re going to tell me your claims aren’t even close to what’s going on here?

    Incase you missed it, I found the last paragraph interesting from Dr. Oz….

    “The companies that are using my name to hawk these products are duping the public. I do not endorse any of these products. By falsely presenting products as ‘scientifically proven’ and endorsed by well-known figures, these companies do a gross disservice to the public health and could even pose a danger to those who believe their false and unproven claims. I am taking this step in the interest of public safety. I feel compelled to stand up against these companies and their deceitful practices.” -Dr. Mehmet Oz

    and I suppose Mona Vie had nothing to do with this, mr. regular guy? Maybe you can point me in the direction on where you as a distributor of M.V. have the permission from the Packer organization to promote your product?

    Or maybe…you just heard it from your awesome upline?

  50. switch Says:

    What’s the matter? Cat got your tongue?

    Check these companies out that got sued by Oprah/Dr. Oz…..including M.V.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0a4eUKG0Ws

    Look who shows up right around the 40 second mark!

    You may not be in to get rich but I’m sure you wouldn’t mind a little more spending cash on the side eh, mr. regular guy?

    Are you seeing your pattern on your claims and testimonies?

    You’re sound proof with your comments/posts that the lies and deception are still flyin high.

    Like Larsen says….awwwh, “it’s like herding cats”.

  51. a regular guy Says:

    no i just didn’t have time to get on last night…other priorities. your right i wouldn’t mind a little extra on the side, who would? but i don’t really sell it, i drink it and some friends of mine buy it from me, but i sell it at cost, i have even given a fair amount away. I would rather drink an Emv than soda because it is no doubt healthier than soda and tastes pretty damn good, a few of my friends really like to use them for mix drinks.

    and i’m sure that M.V. had something to do with the Oprah claims….maybe the wording got stretched and exaggerated by the distributors, kinda like a fish story. but Oprah did make claims about the Acai berry…no product but she praises the Acai berry…so using that information along with the fact the Monavie has the best Acai product as far as potency, nutrition value per dollar, and taste…i understand that its a lot easier to lump those two facts into one, but just because Monavie wouldn’t give Oprah a cut for endorsement because thats not the business structure, your right it needs to be clear that they are separate statements so Oprah doest get her panties in a bunch and sue again…but you can conclude on your own that those two statements can make one statement. and so with the packers i don’t have their permission to so anything, (the following is an example and have no knowledge of it being true or false) “i walk into Sam’s Club and see the whole Packers team buying Member’s Mark Boneless Chicken Breasts.”
    So its against the law for me to tell you something like that? i would bet you would have to sue a lot of Sam’s clubs employees and customers, because i bet they would tell their friends what happened when they went to the Grocery store…if i saw that i sure would. anytime i talk about anything i make sure i have facts to back it up. and you cant tell me that any of the claims i have made are false because, well, they are true. it is “scientifically Proven” that the Acai berry kills 86% of leukemia cells, it is fact the Oprah and Dr. Oz praised the Acai berry for being a very powerful fruit, it is also fact that Monavie has the best Acai Formula, and it is fact that not all but some of the players on the Packers drink Monavie.

    and you didn’t really have anything to say about my statement on psychology, seems like that cat has your tongue.

  52. switch Says:

    I know alot of people who wouldn’t….

    Did you read and view those links???? Plain and simple, you’re in denial and living the hype and all the other lies.

    regular guy says-
    “team is a company that teaches leadership skills, business concepts, psychology”…..

    I didn’t have anything to say but to LMAO about your team/psychology theory because team doesn’t teach psychology on a professional level. So did you, or did you not say they taught psychology? Yes, you DID!

    Deceptive much, mr. regular guy? Yes, you are which is in line with team PERFECTLY.

    Lets get this straight…
    NO WAY is team qualified to teach and give such lessons. Maybe friendly advice but no where in their history have they been qualified to do so. If they’re qualified, show me.

    \
    “psychology is “the science of the mind or of mental states and processes. the science of human and animal behavior.” not a a degree, because a degree is just verification of knowledge”

    WTF????? What you fail to tell here is that the degree gives that person qualifications to use his/her education in a professional manner. No? Look it up. Do some research outside of team and see what you come up with. That may be your 1st problem…putting your “inspirational” tool scheme down for once and actually see what else is offered. Let your audience know that what really matters is your tool scheme you offer behind the scenes. Is that or is that not what team/life is all about now?

    Psychology isn’t a degree????? Have you ever looked at certain schools to see what they offer if one is interested in pursuing that field? My guess is no, you’re too busy listening to BULLSHIT being spewed by your ex Quixtar/Amway uplines who seems to have the same mentality as you. “The team way or the highway”, you know…”fake it til you make it”. Let me guess…you’re going to tell me that’s not where they came from. LOL, little do you know. Or, you were hoping I didn’t know about the history?

    Will you fill me in on the history behind team or are those still considered the “pesky little facts” that will never be disclosed at house plans? You know…the truth. Seeing how this is such a great opportunity and biz, tell me about the history behind team…it’s all good right?

    regular guy says~
    “it is also true that a lot of Packers drink the Active blend”

    then, regular guy says~
    “that the Acai berry kills 86% of leukemia cells, it is fact the Oprah and Dr. Oz praised the Acai berry for being a very powerful fruit, it is also fact that Monavie has the best Acai Formula, and it is fact that not all but some of the players on the Packers drink Monavie.”

    ….now, it’s only some players???? AND You’re HEARING YOUR SCIENTIFIC FACTS FROM M.V.! And why haven’t they spread the word that it treats cancer/luekemia?

    Larsen’s Royal Tongan Limu….here’s why they were shut down.

    “Dallin Larsen and Dynamic Essentials/Royal Tongan LimuMonaVie CEO and founder Dallin Larsen was previously a senior executive with an MLM company that sold a similar juice product prior to being shut down by the FDA for illegal business practices. Larsen, who was “a 20-year-veteran of the multi-level marketing industry”, “left a senior post at another juice company in 2002, a year before the FDA destroyed the company’s ‘bogus products’ that were being falsely promoted to treat ‘cancer, arthritis and attention deficit disorder’.” The company in question, Dynamic Essentials, distributed an MLM juice product known as Royal Tongan Limu juice. According to the U.S. Federal Trade Commission Dynamic Essentials, from 2001 to 2003, had illegally advertised that Royal Tongan Limu ””was clinically proven to cure, prevent, or treat a range of diseases and disorders such as allergies, diabetes, cancer, and Alzheimer’s disease.”

    Sounding familiar yet, mr. regular guy?

  53. switch Says:

    And why haven’t they spread the word that it treats cancer/luekemia? Shouldn’t doctors across the world now about this and jumping all over it for the ALMIGHT TREATMENT/CURE ALL?

  54. switch Says:

    It’s good to know that team is still down playing, belittling, and implying that your everyday professional education is simply obsolete. (a dead giveaway/red flag) That is what you’re implying isn’t it sir, with a professional education just being “verification of knowledge” and nothing more? Seriously?

    What you’re not understanding is that this business “opportunity” hasn’t been all sunshine and rainbows like you paint the picture to be. (that’s team at it’s finest)

    And for your Sam’s Club comment…. I’m quite sure if that happened, Sam’s Club would take the precautionary LEGAL steps to promote such products unlike team and giving out illegal claims and testimonies that are supposedly scientifically proven through M.V. Nice try though on the Sam’s Club spin. (Another “point the fingers elsewhere” because, no way in hell can team ever be wrong, right?)

    As LARSEN says, IT’S FRUIT JUICE AND NOTHING MORE.

    Btw, seeing how you reference the GB Packers organization quite frequently, maybe you should take a look around that league to see what EVERY player is wearing a hint of. (Pink, for breast cancer awareness!) Where the hell is Mona Vie????? It’s scientifically proven right? Why don’t we see it on the sidelines seeing how this is the time they promote breast cancer awareness? Huh, you’d think it would be a simple answer seeing how it’s already in the NFL according to you, ace.

    regular guy first says~
    “the Acai berry kills 86% of cancer” (which would give the impression that Acai kills 86% of ALL CANCERS.)

    then regular guy says~
    “that the Acai berry kills 86% of leukemia cells”

    …now, it’s killing 86% of cancer cells within your blood/bone marrow according to mr. regular guy, here.

    Over FRUIT JUICE, regular guy. Do you know how ludicrous that sounds?

  55. a regular guy Says:

    Yes I looked at the links, and I explained how people can expand something, like a fish story or the telephone game (where you whisper a phrase into someone’s ear and it is passed around usually with some changes to the phrase) keep in mind that the distributor is free to say what he wants about the product and a lot of them blew it out of proportion…no denying that.

    And yes I did say that team teaches psychology, and I also said that it is LIKE a college, not the same thing, I don’t get why you have such a hard time understanding that. A psychology degree from a school is different…a lot different, and if you want to become a psychologist you would be better off going to school for it, not team because it doesn’t teach that. But if you want to run any kind of business, manage people, communicate with people, well the team teaches a lot about that. Now its not “The Team way or the highway” who were you quoting because I know I didn’t say that. And also im not on the system of inspirational tools, I get information from A LOT of different sources…some being colleges…but I do buy some of the information provided by the team…if your smart enough you can sift through information finding what will help you do what you want instead of cramming a bunch of irrelevant information in your brain. If you want to sell Monavie the team can teach that, if you want to understand people and why they do what they do the team can teach that, if you want a business education (like how mcdonalds, wal-mart, General electric, ford, and dell computers became successful) the team can teach that, if you want to become a doctor go to med school, if you want a tech education, go to tech school. Im not saying the team completely replaces school, im saying some of the information provided is very helpful for whatever you want to do…you don’t need to sell juice.

    Comment 53 was great. Its because the drug companies would lose a shit ton…same reason cannabis is claimed to have no medical value by the government (currently the federal government provides cannabis to 4 American civilians for medical treatment, and there is at least 1 FDA approved Cannibanoid based drug, cannabis was used in over 1000 different medications in the America before 1937 when Aspirin took off and drug companies flourished ) there have also been a whole lot of documented cancer patients who cured their cancer with cannabis. And Acai is not an almighty cure all as YOU put it, its just really F**king good for you as claimed by Dr. Oz and Oprah…or are you going to tell neither of them think that?

    Really, about my sams club spin. Do you know how many famous people there are in the world…you think every time a famous person buys something the place they went to and the product they bought take precautionary legal steps…that’s just ridiculous. Tony Romo and Jessica Simpson went to Fred’s Parkview and I know that they took absolutely no precautionary legal steps….so, yea what’s your take on that

    And what don’t you understand about how a network marketing company advertises…they wont pay the packers to put an emblem on their players.
    You also have a hard time understanding that Monavie and team are 2 different companies, I know its easy to lump them together but they are 2 different companies that have a mutual business arrangement to improve one another, but can be done separately…I don’t know how to make it any clearer.

    Leukemia is a type of cancer so my statement was true, but your right I should have been more clear…that’s why I made sure to fix that in the next statement. And the statement of Acai killing 86% of leukemia is still true :) most people would be excited that you have a POTENTIAL cancer treatment. leave your comfort zone and look at the truth and facts.

  56. Team Scam Says:

    Regular Guy,

    Since you agree that the “telephone game” nature encourages the false reporting of information (whether purposeful or not), we can conclude that MLM is a poor sales system due to this misinformation that continually replicates down the line.

    This by itself puts the end to any meaningful argument you will have about any MLM being positive. They can choose to avoid this flawed system and by not doing so are doing a great disservice to society.

    Well, my dog teaches psychology as well. I’ve learned to save money from him – he buries bones for a later day. So I guess you could say that my dog is LIKE a college as well. My dog is also LIKE a whale in that he has teeth and lungs. Yes, I’ve made these examples ridiculous on purpose to illustrate the point. While you can say that TEAM teach psychology and is like a college you are really stretching.

    A Regular Guy said, “But if you want to run any kind of business, manage people, communicate with people, well the team teaches a lot about that.”

    That sounds like an MBA degree to me and yes you’d be better off going to school for it. You don’t want to get an MBA degree (perhaps you don’t have the money)? Excellent, go to Personal MBA and start cracking books. You’ll learn all the skills that Team teaches. Most of the reading list is available pretty cheaply on Amazon.com. The information in the Personal MBA is pretty much sifted for you and there’s no organization to join.

    If MonaVie was really a cure for anything, they would do the clinical trials necessary to show it and get FDA approval. People in MonaVie say that the FDA doesn’t approve natural supplements to help with any condition, but they certainly can and do. Here’s a list of them. You will see calcium on there for helping with bone loss as one very common example. So MonaVie simply has to prove that it’s juice helps medically with large scale clinical trials. So don’t paint a picture that drug companies are stopping MonaVie from making claims because they don’t want to lose money. MonaVie is stopping itself because it knows its product doesn’t work… but as long as no one tests it, they can stay in business trying to convince people that it does work.

    There is no documented evidence that cannabis cures cancer. If there were it would be in that list with calcium helping with bone loss.

    Acai is good for you… but so are blueberries and cranberries – Dr. Andrew Weil said that it was a better choice than MonaVie. Meanwhile Oprah and Dr. Oz sued MonaVie – so perhaps they aren’t the people you want to say support it. About that lawsuit, it was the MonaVie distributors that were claiming that Oprah and Dr. Oz directly endorsed MonaVie, when they said no such thing. It’s the Telephone Game thing again. Someone at some point probably noted that they said something positive about acai, but made the false connection that it would apply to MonaVie…

    … It’s important to note that MonaVie is not acai – as we learned here, 4 Ounces of MonaVie is 1 Serving of Fruit, and that juice due to lacking fiber is not as good as just eating fruit.

    You say that the network marketing company won’t pay the Packers to put an emblem on their players, but MonaVie paid to put their logo all over a NASCAR and to put it in celebrity purses. They paid to be the Official Juice of the Boston Red Sox… all of these things just so that their distributors can say, “See it really is a legit product.”

    Your cancer thing isn’t about telling a lie. It is deceptive marketing as defined by the FTC. Please read the endorsement guidelines. You are intentionally leaving out the most important information. Acai hasn’t been shown to kill any percentage of any person’s leukemia ever. Vitamin C has been shown to kill cancer in a test tube. Last I looked vitamin C is much cheaper.

  57. a regular guy Says:

    you really seam to be missing the point i’m trying to make. you say its a scam, but that would mean you get nothing in return, you have to understand what team offers, then you can decide if its what you want. there is A LOT of hype about what it can offer, and delivers to a point and changes need to be made, the MLM industry was a horrible system until team tweaked it, they made it a lot better, it still needs tweaking and they are actively do that to make it better. besides team as a mlm company it does provide a compilation of others information along with their own, if you are educated enough to make your own choices and filter out irrelevant information you can learn a lot, dont get all information from a school, a company, a person, get it from a lot of different sources, and team is a very good provider of the information it provides…but because of all the bashing of team people either get really sucked in to the team life, or think its “a great disservice to society”. if you and the rest of the ignorant people on this page take a step back, get out of the hype in either direction, look at what is provided look for how it can benefit you, take the information that will help you do what you want, and leave the rest for someone else, you might just learn something.

    now monavie, do some more research because MV Pulse is FDA approved to lower cholesterol.
    all fruit is good for you, some better than others, and some have different nutrients for different functions. and monavie just happens to have Acai that is 10 times more potent than anything else in the market. i would like to see more science to back up the juice, but i have used it and know for a fact that Active helped with my back pain more than anything else i have used. i know alot of people who lowered their cholesterol with Pulse, i have also seen the Mmun dramatically boost a very badly damaged immune system. and the energy drink gives me energy, tastes good, and is 100% natural.

    i posted the link to the study conducted by a state university stating that it killed 86%. and yes vitamin C was discovered to possibly help in treatment in the early 70′s…yet there has not been any clinical trial, or a whole lot of any research on the matter, thats about the same time the government studied cannabis as treatment potential…yet did nothing about it and hid the report findings for roughly 20 years. so yea, it has a lot to do with drug companies and government, they want money, not a cure.

    as for cannabis watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPKbFa__hzI&NR=1
    and this
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmviQBB5DHs
    i could talk more about this, but its not related to team so ill leave it unless you would like to continue it.

  58. Team Scam Says:

    There’s nothing about these definitions of a “scam” that says anything about get nothing in return. I see one of the definitions as being a confidence trick. This is what a pyramid scheme is – a confidence trick. The trick is to get people sucked into a system that will pay them back money at some point, but the nature of it means that the promises are left unfulfilled.

    It would be nice if you’d list some of the benefits of Team. I mean the ones other than the education that I can get elsewhere for lower costs.

    I know that MonaVie Pulse is FDA approved to lower cholesterol. However, did you know that CholestOff is 88 TIMES more cost effective than Pulse. This is part of the MonaVie scam. Distributors are more than happy to get people to pay $1500 a year for something that should $17.

    MonaVie’s Acai is not 10 times more potent. You are the victim of another confidence trick. That number comes from comparing a powdered version that has all the water weight taken away. Powdered anything is going measure higher by the gram because you can pack more of it in without the water. It’s more dense. However, when MonaVie reconstitutes the powder (adds water), it is all the same.

    MonaVie Active has not been shown to help with back pain. In fact studies now show that glucosomine doesn’t really help with joint pain – it is the placebo effect.

    There are also no studies to show that Mmun does anything for a immune system – and the “active ingredient” there is slightly modified baker’s yeast – something that you could get for a few pennies.

    Neither of those cancer videos look like they come from any scientific institution of repute. However, you are right, it isn’t worth going into.

    You need to brush up with the 120 posts on sister site: http://www.juicescam.com/. You are entering the conversation armed with only the knowledge of the information the company and your MonaVie upline has fed you.

  59. Patty Says:

    I just joined up with the soon to be released L.I.F.E. at a cost of $87 for which I received a book. A fellow employee where I previously worked has been trying to get me to join for the past year. I don’t think I will continue from this point on as he did tell me I can opt out at any time. I lost my job 3 weeks ago and cannot spend any money on cd’s or books nor do I dare ask anyone to join. Most everyone I know lives pay check to pay check. I’ve read all the comments and am more convinced that it is a scam. Help! Thank you.

  60. Abbott Says:

    Oh Patty. Sorry about losing your job. Personally, having been involved with Team and seeing the progress that you can make after being in it, I feel like it would be much better if you put whatever savings you have into finding a new job. I didn’t realize until after I left TEAM just how much it was really draining my bank account, between the juice, the tickets, the cds and books, and just the freaking gas money to get to all of these things! They talk about how people were in the 6 figures of debt and managed to get out of it by working the TEAM system, but frankly I don’t believe it. Unless you have a whole lot of gullible friends that you can sign up in the next few months to make money off of, you will be much better off leaving it alone and trying to find a new job that will support you immediately instead of just hoping and praying that TEAM pays off at some unnamed point in the future.

    Best of luck.

  61. a regular guy Says:

    Patty,
    i wouldn’t permanently quit. i just wouldn’t put much more money into it with you job status.i was part of the team for about 5 months before i actually joined. you dont NEED to spend as much as people make it seem on here or with team. get off system since it sounds like you dont want to build a community, but stick around your team, they will provide you with free information if you ask…you just have to give it back when your done. pick the information that helps you do what you want, see if you can borrow it from someone.
    thats the best advice i can give you without knowing you….hope it helps

  62. Patty Says:

    Thanks for the input guys. I just have a bad feeling about this whole thing and I know that I am not the type to talk my friends or anyone else into joining especially since what I’ve been reading sounds like one day it will blow up in everyone’s face except for the two founders who at that time may be out of the country. I hope not but it’s just a bad feeling I’m getting.

  63. switch Says:

    “they will provide you with free information if you ask…you just have to give it back when your done.”

    What you really meant to tell her was that, they will provide you with repackaged amway/quixtar material that will hopefully rope you in again to keep feeding their tool scheme now called LIFE.

    Are you going to tell me that this was never part of the story, regular guy?

    Because in comment #42 you said….
    “MonaVie is the first of many companies to be associated with team.”

  64. a regular guy Says:

    no..if that was what i meant to say, thats what i would have said, but its not so i didn’t.

    and some of the information they have is likely close to some of what amway/quixtar…they are similar in some ways but not the same. most of the information they provide is original from TEAM, or from non-associated parties.

    and yes i think it would be very wise to stick around long enough to see what LIFE will have and if it could benefit you.

    its hard to scam someone when the so called scam is provided for free…is it not?

  65. Abbott Says:

    FREE?!?!?! Are you freaking kidding me?!?! That’s the most outrageous thing you’ve said yet. Even if your upline drives to you every event, even if they loan you the books, cds, and materials, you are still on your own for the $5 per week ($20/month) of open meeting tickets, $25/month seminar ticket, and $140 a month of the juice. For someone who’s unemployed that is A LOT OF MONEY AND IT IS CERTAINLY NOT FREE. Regular guy, good for you if this is what you want to do, but this forum is not where you are best using your time. Go show the plan to some people who care.

  66. switch Says:

    YOU SAID THIS~
    “they will provide you with free information if you ask…you just have to give it back when your done.”

    It’s not for free if you’re giving it back,….is it not? Very deceptive, mr. regular guy. If it’s for free why do they have to give it back??? Probably because their upline paid for it, correct? For free? Think again.

    What other companies have been associated with team?

  67. webelieved Says:

    Patty- I would like to recommend you read a site where ex-team LIFE members are speaking out. http://www.amthrax.wordpress.com
    People who made a lot of money with Orrin Woodward and Co are telling the truth how they were stolen from, lied to, decieved and how some had their hard earned incomes stolen. Team/LIFE IS NOT YOUR BUSINESS it is not owned or controlled by you and can be taken whenever they want. PLEASE do not waste your time. It would be better in the long haul to start a business you own and control. Good luck, hope it helps.
    P.s. listen to your gut it will save you a lot of money and heartache.

  68. webelieved Says:

    NOTHING IS FREE ON TEAM/LIFE. NOT EVEN FRIENDSHIP. GO off of system and see what happens.

  69. webelieved Says:

    “they will provide you with repackaged amway/quixtar material that will hopefully rope you in again to keep feeding their tool scheme now called LIFE.” – Switch

    He is right it all comes back to the same ol same ol…..LIFE is the same tool scam/ incoctrination system as Amway. That is where they came from! Look up Orrin Woodward vs Quixtar and all the other lawsuits he lost. He clearly states for many many years he was building an illegal pyramid scheme in Amway, yet he kept building it. I would guess because he was raking in much more dough on his tool business. IE cd’s books etc. You can get the books for free at the library and the sense of community at a church. In my experience and opinion of many years, Team is a destructive cult using thought reform on it’s followers.Proof to me is
    when people stopped listening to Team cd’s/meetings etc they quit, ALWAYS! By the way the CD’s are hand picked to fit your personality and relate to you. They are used to manipulate by your personality. Ask the leaders who left on Amthrax’s site, they will tell you. They all are trained in reading personalities and asking questions like about your dream, hobbies etc. and then using them to get you in.
    Check out http://www.freedomofmind.com or http://www.howcultswork.com
    look up commercial cults or Amway motivational organizations on those sites. There are videos also.
    Please be careful what you read or listen to, your free thinking depends on it. Ask your family and friends for feedback, they will be your protection if you will listen. You can get your dreams and goals faster and they won’t be stolen, somewhere else other then TEAM/LIFE whatever they are calling it these days…… Team of Destiny, Team, Team Monavie, now LIFE Team. Good God why so many name changes you say?……to hide from the critics on the net of course. All my opinions and vast experience with Team . Good Luck!

  70. webelieved Says:

    Patty- was the book your recieved the “Bestseller” Launching a Leadership Revolution? The One that became a bestseller because Orrin had us all buy it early to give out, and had our teams that were huge at the time preorder it to rank it, and later he sent it down on system where everyone in team got more. Then claimed it was a bestsellers? Was it that book?…. Now you’ve heard the rest of the story! :)

  71. Speak Your Truth Says:

    the regular guy~

    It would benefit you and save you some self- embarrassement (and if you aren’t emarrassed.. I am for you) if you would study the ‘history’ of what you are a part of. Here.. Is a brief history..then you could go read all the lawsuits..that should shed some light for you.

    Orrin began in AMWAY back in the early 90′s where he plagerized everything and replicated the ‘system’ from and named the (team) Team of Destiny..then went into Quixtar..Amway’s online Sister Company and changed the name to TEAM..then raided the downline and took it into MV..where now once again he is changing the name to LieF. So the ‘system’ is originally from Amway..and is very much the same only now they have ‘tweeked’ it and called it their own.

    BTW~ You may self-deceive yourself til the cows come home..but you won’t get far on a site like this trying to ‘convince’ anyone.. Anything is FREE…because that is simply FALSE and you know better.

    So go do your research on the ‘history’ of all the different name changes..and all the lawsuits connected to them.

    Do you even know why they continue to change the NAME? You should be able to figure it out.

    One last thing..that is really low and very selfish of you to recommend to Patty.. not to permanently quit..after she has told you she JUST lost her job. Do you realize what you are saying here.. Why don’t you tell Patty exactly what YOU have spent with NO return for the entire time you have been in?

    Patty~

    I too…empathize with you on your job loss..and you already are wise enough and see right though this and know your own situation. Good luck. :)

  72. Abbott Says:

    Webelieved – The book I believe Patty is referring to is actually the book entitled LIFE. It is now a mandatory part of the registration package. It’s basically a bunch of stories and quotes about how great the top 6 families are, and pictures of them enjoying things like vacations to motivate the new people and show them all the things they could have if they just work hard enough . It’s embarrassingly worse than the LLR book.

  73. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Abbott~

    Pretty exspensive ‘scrap book’ to force on others…but then that is how they do things..just like get the LLR..they forced it through thousands to get the status it is at. And interesting for Orrin who says never read your own press clippings..self-promotes himself to the enth degree and then claims humilty…

  74. switch Says:

    I’m sorry, what was that, regular guy???

    What’s the matter? Your upline got your tongue now?

  75. Patty Says:

    To Switch, Abbott, We Believed & Speak Your Truth: Thank you all so very much! I didn’t think my one little question would get so much attention as I thought it and I was insignificant on a large site as this. So thank you again for showing me that I do matter. I just have a reeeeeal bad feeling about this whole thing and really wanted to giveit a try bc a former co-worker as been badgering my to get on his “team” since the early part of the summer. I just purchased the L.I.F.E. book and have yet to open it and it cost my $87 to gein “in”. He said I have about 8 people below me and to just hold on until the launch on 11/1/11. But even if you make some money, you get a 1099 and I’m worried bc I just started collecting Unempl $$ and going to school for a RMA reg. med assistant looks excellent right now and I can still collect while going to school because Uemply. approved it. All that being said, I think I will def tell my former co-worker that I don’t want any part of it. He is 29 now and has a retirement date of next Sept. That is just unreal and scary. And I will check out the website you recommended to me WeBelieve. I will report back! thank you so very much again for taking time to address this concern for me. the other thing my co-worker said was that everyone in the organization is very strong in faith and are Christians.

  76. Patty Says:

    One more thing: I MUST apologize for my terrible spelling and spacing errors! Next time I write a lot I will def go back before clicking submit!

  77. webelieved Says:

    Patty- their words and their actions don’t match. It is an abuse of faith. Their own pastor left them and his whole family that ran the office!
    You will find tons of info on amthrax’s site. Be sure to read “ex-team commenting..” and “Questions for Orrin and Chris Brady”. Talk to your unemployment agency and follow their advice. They should have a money back gaurantee. And do yourself a favor and go to college and get that degree, as no one can take that away from you. If LIFE is so great it will be there when you are done. If you would like to know how you may have gotten people under you in LIFE/Team, read the post “Sling, Squeeze and Side action”.
    Also I would reccomend is read the “Preliminary Compensation Plan Analysis” it will tell you math of the high odds of you not making it on LIFE.
    These should help you make an informed decision either way. Good Luck in your future!

  78. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Patty~

    You are welcome and that is why all of us are here. We do care…have been there..and know how this works.

    Yes they do give you a 1099 and always have, along with every other company in the world…but you certainly have no worries about making any money with or getting one from LieF..The quaranteed FAILURE rate is more than 95%..and there are approximately 7 families out of ten’s of thousands who are making the incomes they brag about.

    I do not blame you for not wanting to not give up one red cent or mess with your school and unemployment..and webelieved had it right..go finish school..it will pay you way more than you will EVER make..more like never make a Profit with LieF.

    We made a lot of money over the years but the majority was reinvested and if I told you how many years and hours of our lives we gave up and what we really made after exspenses and taxes..there would be NO question in your mind..that School is a way better option. And the money we did make went right back into the business and then in the end they stole it all.

    So good luck with your future..it will be way brighter without LieF.

  79. a regular guy Says:

    Abbot-
    first off i was unemployed up until a couple days ago and thats why i haven’t been on here till now. everything is optional, nobody is required to go to or buy any of those things, i know this because i don’t go to everything, or buy the juice regularly..im not on autoship or the system. i do purchase juice, EMV’s, snack bars, CD’s, and Books every now and then, along with some of the functions. as long as my upline had tools he would let us borrow them and give extras away….so thats free enough for me. and the life book is not mandatory, i havent read or purchased it yet.

    Switch-
    read what i wrote to abbott…its frre enough. and Monavie and life. and no one has my tongue…i started a new job so iv been busy…

    webeleive-
    if you actually look at the team’s business plan its different than quixtar or amway…and yea they were pissed that he lead a bunch of people from their business to his own….maybe because quixtar and amway have a shity business plan that he was able to improve. and yes anything that is not original team information can be found elsewhere (library or internet). and if i ever saw a scam or cult its organized religion, their deities and creators have everything figured out but always need money. sure there is some truth in all religions but they all come from the same place which is an interpreted series of events as a story giving certain people in history a name, all religions incorrect with some skewed facts. but also you are right you can get a very good sense of community from church….or Charles Manson.
    and its just not true that they quit, again i will state that i am not on system.
    but thanks for helping prove my point very strongly about the team teaching psychology, they do teach you to read peoples personality and how to influence them, thats what marketing and sales is, that is exactly what i mean by saying they provide good information on psychology. you can take what you learn and apply it somewhere else…like i am doing….so thanks again for proving my point :)
    and they encourage free thinking, they promote it strongly…actually that is one of the main things they teach.
    and again team is its own company, who then became associated with monavie, now life, they are all their own company and you are not required to join one if you join another….why is that so damn hard to understand?

    Speak Your Truth-
    the companies are not very much the same, im pretty sure that orrin used some of the same info he did at quixtar and amway…maybe because some of the information was good and works, it was the business structure that failed, and the amount of info that came from either company is a small fraction of original and others info. and of course its not 100% free, what i am saying is you can get alot for free from your upline…maybe not every upline is that way but mine is and this is what the business is about, too many people get greedy and dont keep the image of the company and im sorry for that, but its hard to control everyone.
    and again team, life, and monavie a separate companies, they each have thir own name, but yes it changes from team destiny to just team…what kind of evil company shortens their name…puff daddy, na P. Diddy, na just Diddy….get the point, it was a name change from a while ago and the 3 companies listed are their own.

    Patty-
    the failure rate listed by speak your truth includes the people who work hard at the business, those who join just for education like me or to get discounted products, if you only look at people who actually do what they are told will work and put effort into building the communiity the rate for success is alot higher…you also bring that success rate down when you join quit because you didnt get rich in 6 months. as for your 1099, you dont have to file that unless you make over $600 in the year you file taxes, although i do not share the religion beliefs, they do promote faith strongly, not specific to any religion but Christian influenced.
    in all i would say go to school, dont claim on the 1099, collect unemployment, and dont say you want no part of, tell him you are still fairly skeptical and need more information but you cant afford it, i’d bet he will let you borrow whatever info he has as long as you need. just talk to him because he is most likely more a friend than just trying to get you into a scam…which should be apparent that its not since he is retiring soon at 29. dont just buy the cd’s n books thinking you dont need to read them or apply what they teach thinking you will retire at 29…if you want it to work just apply it, but maybe you want to learn and apply it somewhere else like i am doing..its up to you and best of luck

  80. Abbott Says:

    Regular Guy – anyone who has been on TEAM will tell you that the pressure to “go to everything” and “commit 100%” and “sell out” (I distinctly remember Bill Lewis yelling about how Tiger Woods had sold out to his sport and that’s why he was so successful, and that’s why you have to “sell out” to the TEAM in order to make it succeed. If you don’t sell yourself, commit 100%, your progress will be slow. That’s what they say. Good for you for finding a job, although if TEAM is everything you think it is, I am surprised you think it’s necessary to keep “carrying buckets” instead of “building a pipeline.” Whatever.

  81. switch Says:

    You told us ALL it was FREE! Meaning and giving the impression that it would be yours to KEEP but you also said you have to give it back! Two different things. That would be very deceptive, you moron!

    Once again, Patty told you how many times she’s opting out of the biz but yet a classic teamer can’t accept NO for an answer and won’t respect any other decisions but yours.

    Keep feeding the lies and deception….see where it gets you.

  82. switch Says:

    oh btw….I think I’ll call O.W. and tell him thanks for providing such a great fruit punch that kills cancer cells.

    What do you think his answer would be? FIRED UP?

    My god, you’re fucking PATHETIC!

  83. a regular guy Says:

    Abbott-
    thanks the job is great. and are you intentionally supporting what i am saying, if you “sell out” or actually apply the training and put in the effort 100% you are right, and as i stated before i don’t plan on getting rich from this, i have other plans. i use team as an information source. i don’t know how to make this any clearer, i do not plan on getting rich from team. but as you stated if you put in the effort it can be done. and the reason i am carrying buckets is because i do not plan on getting rich from this, i use it for the information.

    Switch-
    i made it clear in my statement that it needed to be given back…that is in no way deceptive, you moron!
    and since no one on this site seems to fully understand what it offers or how it works, so im trying to make it clear to someone looking for input. i think if you take a Midol and re-read my statements you would see that i do respect what she is doing, i would benefit in no way no matter what choice Patty makes, so why would i spend time and try to “scam” someone. but as Abbott made clear, if you commit 100% you will succeed.

    lies and deception…really? please point out my lies, end everything i say is clear if you read it all, but like anything you can pick it apart to say almost anything you want, but if you include whole statements its very clear.

    …what was the point of your last statement? but either way there is a lot wrong with it, clearly showing your misunderstanding.

    anybody have anything to say related to Abbott’s and my talk on education?

  84. Patty Says:

    Hi all: I can’t believe all the feedback I have received since I posted my comment about TEAM and L.i.F.E – my former co-worker asked why I would trust a group of faceless people who I know nothing about and have never met rather than him who i have known for 8+ years. I just have a very bad feeling about this pyramind venture and have decided to NOT take it further and if all i lost is $87 then thank God it was only that much. He has brought in customers at my former job and alot of his own family and their friends and so on and if he is right, then they ALL will make alot of $$ – if he is wrong….it will be destruction. He asked that I not make a decision until the launch of LIFE on 11/1. I guess the more names on his team the better for him. I have listened to 6 different cd’s he loaned me and not one did anything for me….they all sound TOO happy, almost phony. I have decided to attend school for a CMA (cert med asst)which is approved by unemployment so I will not lose my benefits as I’ve NEVER before collected and I am 53 yrs old. I was able to get 2 student loans, did apply for grants but was denied. I am pretty sure now that I was let go at my job bc I was the oldest one there but now realize I am by no means ready to be thrown away like garbage because they think I’m no longer worth anything. My worth has NO figure especially in God’s eyes!!! :=))

  85. webelieved Says:

    Patty- I will tell it straight….I made rounded to 100,000/yr on Team (you will understand I cannot give exact number for identification reasons) and they stole it! Stole my teams! MY EFFORT! Take that one to the bank Other Guy….You can read about it an others like me on Amthrax…..ask yourself what do I have to gain by telling you this? NOTHING….I just do not want another person to fall for the scam of a team business that is not yours, you own nothing and deception is used to get you and keep you in. Read the contract and take it to an attorney, he will tell you to run…IF they will even give you the contract up front….what legit business does this? NONE!
    I was with Orrin when it was Team of Destiny, Team, Team Leadership, Team Monavie, and now they are changing their name to LIFE TEAm. Don’t try your b.s. on me Other Guy,it won’t work! Please Patty read http://www.amthrax.wordpress.com for your own good….good luck at school……I would be doing very well right now if years ago,someone would have stood up and told the TRUTH about this so called business/cult and it would have saved me years of effort I could’be put in a legitimate business/career. Now I am starting over with NOTHING…..after financial devastation! From theft after YEARS and YEARS OF WORK AND LEAVING OUR KIDS!
    all my experience and opinions with Team/Orrin Woodward and Co. of course.

  86. webelieved Says:

    Patty- Those cd’s are being handpicked to manipulate your personality. be careful what you listen to. It is done on purpose!
    I am glad you see your worth in God.
    Since you are a believer I wanted to say in my opinion there is a lot of idolatry, false edification, and heresey in Team ……. If you can keep your critical thinking you will see it…..
    Have you read Athena Dean.. “All THAT GLITTERS IS NOT GOD”? I have heard she was some what successful in mlm and has a very interesting perspective on it, as a Christian wanting to live a life of integrity.

  87. webelieved Says:

    Correction- I meant Regular Guy.

  88. a regular guy Says:

    Patty-
    good luck at school, anything in the med field is stable…except corporate drug companies. and team is not for everyone, im glad to hear you listened to some cd’s though.

    webelieved-
    could you tell me your story and how they stole your team?

  89. webelieved Says:

    Reguar Guy- You can read it at http://www.amthrax.wordpress.com
    under “ex-team commenting about their experiences”
    It is easier to take you money and teams away now, apparently it says in their new contract they can take it for ANY reason, with or without cause.
    Wish I knew that years ago,and we had a contract they would let us read, before I gave it all, did the work, and missed years of our kid’s lives! You see I thought just like you at one time, until their actions proved my beliefs wrong, and broke the rose colored glasses.

  90. webelieved Says:

    We weren’t given a contract until after we did the work and were being paid, and when we signed a 20+ pg contract they wouldn’t let us get a copy or take it home, to an attorney. Now Orrin refuses to send us a copy of it!
    Some up and up company that is! NOT!

  91. webelieved Says:

    Regular Guy- It will save you a lot of time and heartache to read amthrax’s whole site and then talk over there. There are a lot of BIG leaders Round Tables/people close to Orrin etc. speaking out about their experiences with Orrin and Team/now LIFE. Please do yourself a favor and read it all. Too much truth to be denied. You will see how George Guzzardo had his luxury 2nd property in forclosure, up until a few months ago, or how Darkangelo, Hubers and another filed bankruptcy in past few years? Look for those articles.
    The other thread that is pretty direct is “Questions for Orrin and Chris Brady”
    Good luck, let us know what you find interesting…. :)

  92. switch Says:

    regular guy says-
    “i made it clear in my statement that it needed to be given back…that is in no way deceptive, you moron!”

    Well then, it isn’t for free, is it?! I hope you can also make that clear? Get the point through your thick head, yet???? YOU’RE UPLINE PAYS FOR IT, AND IN RETURN, YOU HAVE TO GIVE IT BACK! So, with you saying FIRST that it is in FACT FOR FREE, is very DECEPTIVE and would give the first time reader the impression that it is. But, that’s the name of the game, regular guy. Anything to get them in. When are you going to start being HONEST with yourself, here?????

    Here’s my point with my last statement of being PATHETIC.

    You’re hear trying to tell us all that you have a FRUIT PUNCH that kills cancer cells (specifically towards leukemia). But you also announce to everyone that you’re unemployed or was…..is it clicking yet?

    Rest assured, if you had a product killing cancer cells as you speak of, I’m 110% positive, the last thing you’d be talking about is how you’re unemployed.

    BTW, here’s an interesting LIE we can start with.
    \
    a regular guy Says:
    October 4th, 2011 at 11:58 pm
    “…keep in mind that the distributor is free to say what he wants about the product…..”

    Show us where it says, you’re FREE to say what you want about it….Hey, it’s gotta be somewhere in the rules, right??? Or was it your PATHETIC A$$ making those rules up?

    Do I need to go on about your lies and deception?

  93. team deception Says:

    It looks as if Orrin has found a new pastor to try and bring legitimacy to his cult. Orrin introduced him a top ten pastor???? That is hilarious. Not only is Orrin self proclaiming himself as a top ten leadership guru but now he has the authority to proclaim a pastor top ten in the country. Only a man that is a complete narcissistic devil could even think about saying something like that. Tell me Orrin, what makes a pastor top ten?

    The new face of the cult is Stephen Davey from Colonial Baptist Church in North Carolina, http://www.colonial.org/. Could this be the Brady’s pastor? I think that they moved to NC. I feel for Pastor Davey as he has no idea what is about to hit him.

  94. a regular guy Says:

    webeleive-
    ill check it out soon.

    switch-
    you don’t seem to have very many good points. and for some reason you still don’t understand why i’m here, since you love quoting me so much o back and look at how many times i stated what im doing. i am not trying to sell you any juice, and i think its rather PATHETIC that you still have that impression, keep those blinders with a narrow angle.
    and yes any idiot who signs on to distribute monavie..or anything else for that matter…is free to state anything they want…doesn’t make it all true, doesnt mean they should make false statements, just because something can be done doesnt mean it should be. there are distributors who make false or uninformed claims and that is a problem.

    and nobody has said anything about my psychology education claim after abbott agreed with me…i just find that kinda funny

  95. Abbott Says:

    Regular Guy – for the record, I was not agreeing with you. My point was that the PC will tell people anything to get them to spend all their hard-earned (at WORK) money on tickets and BS. You realize that this “education” you’re so stoked about is going directly into their pockets, right? Get the recommendations about books and then get them cheap on amazon or from the library, but please don’t buy them at seminars for full price. It’s just silly.

    Additionally, I was not agreeing with you because I KNEW people when I was in TEAM (yes, i was in it, so I’m speaking from experience) who “sold out” and gave up nights and weekends with their kids and went to everything, spent HUNDREDS if not THOUSANDS of dollars a month, went go-getter repeatedly… i.e, did EVERYTHING the PC said to do to “win in this” and HAVE NOTHING TO SHOW FOR IT. They have rescheduled their retirement dates MULTIPLE TIMES.

    THIS DOES NOT WORK FOR THE VAST MAJORITY OF PEOPLE. Ergo, I do not agree with you.

    All I wanted was to make sure Patty didn’t get sucked in, and from what she said, we accomplished that.

  96. Patty Says:

    Hi all: I just received this email bc I had not yet given formal notice that I’m OUT…
    It’s quite long but I want your opinion. There’s NO way I can do this as the $$ situation now is LESS coming IN but MORE going out due to paying my own health insurance and a loan for partial payt of school. I can’t afford $1.00 so forget about the costs they list below:

    As a customer of Team you are being given the unique opportunity to participate in the pre-launch of a new business called LIFE. Below is a summary of the steps you will need to take anytime between Friday October 21st at 8:00 pm EST and Saturday October 29th at 11:00 pm EST. The Team customer relationships that exist remain unchanged through this process.

    Step 1
    For existing Team customers, you will need to login to the Team website, where you will see a new left margin option called LIFE. After selecting this option, you will be provided with three LIFE documents that you can either read online or print. The three documents are:
    •The Independent Member Application and Agreement
    •The Member Compensation Plan
    •The Member Policies and Procedures

    In order to become a LIFE Member you must agree to the terms and information contained in these documents via electronic signature by checking the box. You will then be asked to complete the online enrollment form and pay for your Member enrollment ($35) and for your Business Starter Kit ($50 and 50PV), which totals $85 in the United States or Canada plus tax, shipping and handling. The Business Kit will be shipped on November 1st, 2011.

    Step 2
    You will next be given the option to subscribe to any combination of LIFE’s three distinct subscription products. They are:
    •The LIFE Series – dedicated to helping people in each of the 8 F categories – Faith, Family, Finances, Fitness, Following, Freedom, Friendship, and Fun. 4 CDs and a book shipped each month. $50 and 50 PV
    •The LLR (Launching a Leadership Revolution) Series – dedicated to helping people grow in their leadership ability. 4 CDs and a book shipped each month. $50 and 50 PV
    •The AGO (All Grace Outreach) Series – dedicated to helping people grow spiritually. 1 CD and a book shipped each month. $25 and 25 PV

    The LLR and AGO Series CDs are no longer available through Team for those that have previously subscribed to those products. Your payment will be processed immediately and your first subscription shipment is scheduled for November 1st, 2011.

    Step 3
    Team has made some changes to their training system options that will result in some changes to current Team Training System customers.

    Team will now be offering one training system package with a couple optional add-ons. This change is effective with the November 7th shipping cycle and new forms will be posted on the Team website October 27th.

    Team Training System
    •Consists of 2 Team CDs and 2 SOL CDs, designed to teach all facets of community building. The optional add-ons are:
    – Standing Order Monthly Seminar Tickets
    – DVD of the Month
    – The Spanish option will contain a book of the month
    •Languages:
    – English
    – French
    – Spanish
    – DVD is English only.
    •Distribution will continue to be every 2 weeks.

    All Team customers that are currently on the Basic, Power Player or Leadership packages will automatically be transitioned to the new option and will not be required to do anything. If you already take advantage of the Standing Order Ticket and or the DVD add-ons, you will see no interruption.

    Enrollment Summary
    •All new accounts will have to wait to register with LIFE and Team on November 1st, 2011.
    •Starting Friday October 21st at 8:00 pm EST existing Team customers can enroll with LIFE via the Team website. All existing Team customers who want to enroll with LIFE must do so prior to Saturday October 29th at 11:00 pm EST. At this time we are finalizing the pre-launch enrollment and will not be adding anyone who misses the deadline.
    •Beginning November 1st, 2011 at 11:11 am EST enrollment in LIFE will be open for new accounts via the LIFE website at http://www.the-life-business.com or http://www.the-life-business.ca.

  97. Abbott Says:

    Hi Patty,

    I will try and explain, I don’t have a huge knowledge of this because I quit about four months ago, but from what I understand, here’s what’s happening:

    TEAM has been partnered with MONAVIE to make money. Monavie, consuming it and selling it to other people, is the way distributors make money. Once you get higher up in the ranks of TEAM (i.e. once you’ve signed up a specific number of people in each of your legs) you qualify to start earning money based on other things such as ticket sales, CD and book sales. That’s how the top dogs in the business keep getting richer and richer, and why the price of tickets and things keep going up, although you probably have not been involved long enough to see those things happen.

    What is happening now, as I see it, is that TEAM is moving away from MONAVIE as it’s main income source, and is instead starting to use its own set of tools (what regular guy refers to as an education) to sell for money instead. As you can see, you can earn PV by buying CD’s and books, and presumably, by selling them to other people as well. So this makes it possible to make money by selling the TEAM materials rather than, or in addition to, selling the purple fruit juice. Does that make sense?

    Now, as many people on here have agreed, including Switch and webelieved, there is some value to be had in these books and stuff. HOWEVER…. to charge $100 a month for 8 CD’s (CD’s made by leaders who are just rich, mind you, not scholars in the areas they talk about) and two books which could be found for probably half the price on Ebay or Amazon, is highway robbery plain and simple. As you said, you can’t spare the money on this stuff, it’s best to leave it alone. This is just another way to keep people involved and keep them spending money so that it benefits the top tier leaders of TEAM.

  98. webelieved Says:

    Holy Smokes! If anyone signs up for LIFE they have lost their minds! Read the P&P and contracts, there is NO protection for the distributor in fact it looks as if you will sign your life, and rights away to them forever! I think it binds you even after you quit. TAKE IT TO AN ATTORNEY BEFORE SIGNING, they have put clauses all over the place how they can steal your work! Read it on amthrax site. The lengths these crooks will go to in order to make money is amazing!

  99. webelieved Says:

    If ANYONE SIGNS this and builds it I cannot feel sorry for you, it is in black and white. This contract also shows what we said happened to us is the TRUTH, for God’s sake now they even have it in their contract! Thanks Orrin for showing who you really are…… arbitration, legal theft…this gets better and better! LOL!

  100. sheryl Says:

    OH Yes in my first statement I forgot to tell you they compare there new launch to Face book that is there new pitch Look at face book how they started this is getting big here in KS

  101. a regular guy Says:

    abbott-
    it doesnt matter if you think you agree or not because what you stated about hand picking cd’s to fit someones personality is agreeing. and “selling out” would just be doing exactly what someone who wants to accomplish anything should do (not specifically this, but anything). and your right about not everyone succeeding or doing well….not everyone can be a doctor, counselor, or mechanic because everyone is different and has their own interests and skills…so just like i could not be a professional mechanic (because i have no idea about cars and they dont make sense to me) there are a lot of mechanics that can fix anything with a car….so just because i cant do it doesnt make the profession wrong. and maybe someone only learns about how a car engine works and applies that knowlege to something else, its not a wast of time or a failure….so even if you dont want to agree with me, you did. team offers useful information in its field.
    and yes i have looked on amazon and other places for the books they recommend and 9 out of 10 times it was within $1, and team actually has some cheaper than amazon. so sorry but there isnt a very big mark up in team if any. but yes the library is free….so why do countless people spent upwards of $10,000 a semester at state universities and colleges? try to move to another state in our country to go to school and the price doubles if not triples…aint that some shit.

    so in short traditional school has advantages and disadvantages, team has advantages and dis advantages, neither is perfect. just because it doesnt work for you doesnt mean its wrong….i still cant do a damn thing to my truck.

  102. Former Round Table Says:

    Oh for crying out loud, Regular Guy, THINK!!!

    Of all the people who decide to become mechanics, how many do you think succeed? How many people who go to medical school become doctors? How many people who go to college graduate and get jobs? Is it 10%? 50%? 80%?

    Compare those numbers to how many people join and follow the team/life system and succeed. Less than 1/10th of 1% EVER make anything!!!! (Go ahead, prove me wrong.)

    So are you telling us all that 99.9% of the people who join team/life are not qualified, or do not have the aptitude, or are unable to learn these wonderful skills? Maybe that should be disclosed to people before they spend thousands of dollars and years of hard work for nothing!

    Oh wait, I’ll bet you’ll tell us that all those folks are just losers or quitters or weren’t willing to really do the work. Really? Many of these same folks have college degrees and decent jobs–how did that happen?

    Take it from one who DID succeed, in spite of the odds. It’s a scam, it’s a lie, and you will have to sell your soul to make it work.

    BTW, give me ONE example of a book you can purchase from the team that you can’t get cheaper on Amazon. (Team charges full price, that’s RETAIL, on every book. If you ever pay full price on Amazon, well buddy, you ain’t gonna make it anywhere.)

  103. webelieved Says:

    REGULAR GUY…….HAVE YOU READ ANY OF MY COMMENTS??
    The Team does not give you a DEGREE it is NOT a legit education…. anyone will acknowledge…..get a clue….
    it is unauthorized book reports on cds with a bit of deception and stories mixed in…… They have stolen from and lied to their own leaders……and you still will follow them for a buck? You need a check up from the neck up….

  104. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Regular Guy~

    You are digging your hole deeper and deeper. No worries.. those of us here.. expect this from the brainwashed defenders.

    You are in a losing battle..Go Read the P&P! I bet you didn’t. YOU signed your rights away now and are bound to what they demand. You have not only violated the Lief P&P but also MV tells you to not even click on sites like these..you are Not proving to be ‘teachable’ here regular guy.. by you coming on here ‘aruging’ with those that have been around, way longer and have built teams to mulitple thousands and been up close and personal to the PC/Orrin..If I were a betting person I would bet your profit-sharing on it…lol

    By you ‘violating’ this new P&P you have just given them the Right to strip you of (your)..it never was (your) b-business’ silly..You have to OWN for it to become a b-business..It IS Orrin’s business, HE OWNS it.

    You best read the P&P.. the dictatorship you just signed your life away to. You now have allowed them to gag you, your family,from anything that would bring embarrassment or bad on their supposed ‘goodwill’ reputation and you are never allowed to bring on a class action suit, even if they steal your entire team (which I doubt you have much of one).

    So in other words regular guy lets use some examples..you better hope you or your family never have a brush with the law, go through a divorce, go bankrupt or a million other scenario’s that could bring ‘bad’ on their ‘good reptutation because they have the discretion to do whatever they wish as punishment..like taking your buisness and giving it to someone else. Also, better read there is NO passive, willable, ongoing business for you.

    Don’t worry they will wait and won’t do that until you have put in YEARS of time, money, and effort and created thousands on your team..if they last that long..because they will need something to steal from you first!

  105. a regular guy Says:

    wow, i must have made a good point because my last comment was deleted….talk about shady business, so i will have to sum it up because i dont remember everything i wrote.

    former round table-
    can you site a single statistic you listed?
    or prove that you are a former round table?
    amazon has the business school book for $14.74 new from 1 seller, and 4 sellers between $140 and $170 the chaepest used book was $17
    team has the same book for $12 or $15 i dont remember what one, but even if it was 15 you would save a whole 26 cents on amazon…
    and i explained further in my deleted comment that marking something up is how our economy works, its how people make money, look at walmart, not many people have a problem with walmart and those who do is because they sell it cheaper putting small business out of business….

    webeleived-
    who gives this authorization to say information is valid? government, the people who turned our countries economy into garbage?
    please provide proof that you had your teams stolen and you where so successful.

    Speak your truth-
    just dont be a sketchy person and you wont have to worry about losing your teams

    the following is to everyone and should be read until it is fully comprehended, and

    team and monavie are two (2)different companies that do business together.
    team is a community building company, they main goal in business is to build communities. they teach the people in the community to understand and relate to people, how to influence others, how to do things that have a win-win outcome instead of a win-lose outcome. they also teach you haw to have healthy successful relationships with others, how to find whatever it is that will motivate oneself to accomplish what they desire. the information that is taught to the community is sold to them on a free-will basis. the profits that come from the sold information are distributed throughout the community of people based on performance. so if you are not performing in distributing the information you do not get as much of the shared profits as someone who who distributes more information.
    monavie is a company the sells the most potent Acai on the market, they only way you could get a more potent Acai is if you go to brazil and get them within 36 hours from when they are picked. Acai is ONE of the 19 fruits that make up the monavie formula. there are 4 differntly formulated monavie premium blend juice’s, 1 kosher certified, two 100% natural energy juice’s, and a weight management and dietary supplement product line. all monavie products are sold by independent distributors, team is a company that partnered up with monavie to help them build their community of independent distributors. 50% of the profits from all sales are distributed based on sales performance to the community of independent distributors.

    i use the team as one of my many sources of information, i don’t actively distribute information or build the team community. i will share information with others in conversation if it is relevant, but i do not do this for money or try to get everyone i meet involved, its rare that i will introduce someone to what team is. again, i do not do this for money. in case you didn’t catch it, i do not do this for money.

    and as far as monavie, i typically buy the EMV energy drinks for myself. i buy the premium blend juices rarely but sometimes. the only time i sell any EMV’s is to my friends because they tried it and loved it (i sell it to them at the same cost i buy it, or provide them in my home for drinks instead of soda or beer) the only time i sell any other juice is when i randomly meat someone and find it relevant to a conversation we may be having (needless to say, i dont sell much…or any lately)

    so after all that being said, stop with all of the speculation and give me some facts about how its a scam. prove that you were scammed. no one has listed any real facts about how either company is a scam.

    please provide something intelligent and factual.
    and one more time for anyone that may have misunderstood….im not in this for money

  106. Former Round Table Says:

    Hahahahaha! Regular guy, please do not regurgitate all those Team “talking points” to us — chances are you heard those from a CD one of us made. (I am not proud.) I am very familiar with all that “Team builds communities, MV sells juice, blah blah blah.”

    You have clearly been thoroughly brain-washed and stopped thinking for yourself. I did not cite statistics, I asked a question. As in, “How many people who attend medical school become doctors?” I don’t know the answer, but I am confident that it is more than 1%. How many people who join the team make it to Round Table–the level at which you can reasonably support yourself? I don’t have the exact number, but if you take off your blinders, you might be able to figure it out. (How many people were at the major last week? How many Round Table members? Do the math. And don’t give me the standard talking point that it takes 2-5 years to become Round Table, so of course there will be fewer of those then attending the seminar. Team has been selling their own materials since 1999. Literally hundreds of thousands of people have been churned. There should be more than 30 Round Table members by now, don’t you think?)

    Here is the bottom line: Those who succeed in Team are those who are best at manipulating people into believing they are buying and investing in a business, and that the profits are distributed fairly to those who do the work, blah, blah, blah. The scam is that it is NOT true!!! You are NOT building a business, at least one that YOU control. You are slaving away for the benefit of and at the sole whim of Orrin Woodward, who can take away anything and everything you work for at will. If he doesn’t have a good reason, he will make one up. Profits are NOT distributed fairly, they are distributed to those that Orrin likes best.

    You say 50% of the profits are distributed back. Can you prove that? Nope, I thought not.

    I will not prove to you that I was at one time successful with Team. I know more about Orrin’s personal life than you can ever learn. So what. You keep believing the lies and hype, I really don’t care!

  107. a regular guy Says:

    former round table-
    ” Less than 1/10th of 1% EVER make anything!!!! (Go ahead, prove me wrong.)” ok is that number including people like me who do not build the business? and where did that statistic come from? and why won’t you prove that you were successful?
    again all you are saying is speculation..no facts, no proof, no nada.
    do you know how many people dont work in their field after graduation, how many people go back to get second or third degrees because the cant do anything with their current one. you have been brainwashed just like the rest of our country, the whole modern culture that has been built is destructive to itself and our planet, we are slaves to money that is out of our control…for no good reason what so ever, if every one shared, weren’t greedy, and did their part we wouldn’t have the problems that we do, and i would not be able to have this conversation with anyone.

    yes 50% is distributed back…its proved already…they clearly outline the compensation plan and it is available on their website…

    since i only started writing on here to help inform new and skeptical team members, if no one can bring up any hard facts or proof of their claims (which they seem to cause such a commotion over when its about something else) i feel like im wasting time…and the lack of facts and no proof of claim should be a good eye opener to anyone checking out this site.

  108. Abbott Says:

    Dear Regular Guy,

    You are violating two rules of the new LIFE P&P. Careful or they’ll kick you out and force you to find books and an education on your own.

    3.3.11.9 – Responding to Negative Posts
    Do not converse with one who places a negative post against you, other independent Members, or LIFE. Report negative posts to the Company at corpsupport@the-life- business.com. Responding to such negative posts often simply fuels a discussion with someone carrying a grudge that does not hold themselves to the same high standards as LIFE, and therefore damages the reputation and goodwill of LIFE.

    3.3.11.2 – Identification as an Independent LIFE Member
    You must disclose your full name on all Social Media postings, and conspicuously identify yourself as an independent Member for LIFE. Anonymous postings or use of an alias is prohibited.

  109. Abbott Says:

    P.S. Thanks http://amthrax.wordpress.com

  110. Former Round Table Says:

    Regular Guy, your “facts” seem to be nothing more than “they told me this so it’s true.”

    You said, “yes 50% is distributed back…its proved already…they clearly outline the compensation plan and it is available on their website…”

    Oh my goodness, are you really that naive? They can post whatever they want on their website, but unless they show you their bank deposits and payouts, you really don’t have any proof, do you?

    Bud, you ARE wasting your time. I have known Orrin way longer than you, and believe me, if his business were such a great deal, I would be pushing it harder than anyone. But unfortunately I have witnessed first-hand how this man has devolved into a sociopathic, narcissistic megolamaniac. He has studied how best to manipulate human nature for years now, and he is way better at it than you or I could ever hope to be.

    If you want to spend your life defending trash, it’s a free country, go for it. But don’t ever think you will convince me you are right.

  111. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Thanks Abbot for putting up the P&P references. This guy is a waist of time. It is obvious he is a broken CD and is convinced..’brainwashed’.. beyond his senses. He can’t go a sentence without spewing the rhetoric.

    It is too sad, they don’t see that we are here to help, but then we all understand, because we have been there.

    A year or 2 from now, (if the Lief isn’t shut down or sunk) when he realizes he really got in for the money and isn’t making a profit, and can’t afford the ‘system’ any more because he has dug a black hole of debt and is wondering how to crawl out of it, and realizes all their books can be gotten for free from the library or at a better cost, some for a few dollars on ebay and is being utterly controlled by the P&P and the control freaks/dictators themselves, and is nothing but a system count to them..it will hit him like a ton of bricks.

    Then no choice but to pull yourself out of the illusion, and begin the dismal reality check and face up to… he was scammed.

  112. switch Says:

    It’s like talking to a brick wall, isn’t it?

    We laid out everything for him and he STILL can’t get it through his thick f’ing head.

    With every post you’ve managed to pull out of your ass, I’ve come to the conclusion you need more help than what we can offer.

    …and you’re calling me pathetic because supposedly, I haven’t done my homework? Excuse me $hithead, but I’m not the one fronting a fruit punch, spouting claims such as “killing cancer”, “no more aches and pains”, and only god knows what else you have up your slimy sleeve to yes, LURE them into the team/life biz of inspirational tools such as books and cds you sell BEHIND THE SCENES. What gives you the right to claim and spread such A$$ININE comments about a FRUIT PUNCH? Who told you, M.V.? Really? Go and try and tell an every day Orthopedic Oncologist what you’ve told us and see what he comes back with.

    Boy, I’d love to be a fly on the wall there.

  113. Gonzalez Says:

    There have been two church splits at Tom Ascol’s church in the last two years. On the last occasion, he was left almost with no deacons, including the treasurer. The best members departed because things are really bad at Tom’s church.

  114. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Gonzalez~

    Can you explain more about what caused the splits?

    And are they seeing a lot of people being recruited into the Team-LieF?

  115. sheryl Says:

    I guess there was 20,000 people in Ohio the last part of Oct. Thats alot of people to be recurited. Do you think this is a “Ponsey” Scam?

  116. webelieved Says:

    Sheryl- where did you get the number 20,000? Just wondering, Orrin has been known to exagerate his numbers.
    Read the P & P. Previously many leaders have had their “businesses” stolen, taken by Orrin and Co. People who did years worth of work. Beware! Their new policies and procedures in LIfE now say they can take your business for no reason or cause! You will be trapped in arbitration for life, by LIFE, even if you quit! It will tell you what you can and cannot do, also what your kids and family can and cannot do! What a joke! If anyone signs it they are crazy in my opinion!

  117. webelieved Says:

    They are falsely advertising/implying a residual, btype, systems, income. LIE!
    According to their own contracts, you are on review by your upline, who by the way benefits if they can kick you to the curb and take your business/team. You got it, it seems the very person who can benefit if your business is taken, choses wether or not you keep it. So if he needs a raise…….or someone doesn’t like you ……or whatever reason…….?
    too bad you lose your business.

  118. sheryl Says:

    TO Webelieved: I thought in the beginning of my discussions I told you my best friend tried to get me in this group I went to one meeting in September.and knew what this was I heard of this 2005. My friend and her husband went to Ohio and she was so thrilled when she told me there was 20,000people there and this had to be great and this a Christian organization be caused they use the scripture from Galatians. She became very angry with me when I told her they were selling her dream I told her when she became a millionaire to remember me. She said not everyone is meant to be a millionaire I ask her how much she has spent and she said 200 on tapes.

  119. Patty Says:

    Hi Guys & Gals! I want to first thank ALL of you for your insight, comments, suggestions etc on a very hot topic. I still cannot believe all the responses I’ve read since I wrote my very first comment on Oct. 12th. I truly appreciate all your thoughts and am definitely NOT going forward with this. My fromer co-worker said his “upline” whatever that is, offered to buy the first month’s item so that I could stay in…or something like that! I politely said thanks but no thanks and wished all of them well. He is a really nice guy, has a wife and 2 young children and I hope and pray he will not meet with disaster as he has brought in not only his family, but his in-laws, friends and customers that he has from his day job. I just cannot understand why this scam still exists, being so ruthless and crooked as it is, and no one can stop this guy???? Why hasn’t the BBB or the Feds shut the entire organization down??? Maybe their time is coming now and LIFE will mean just the opposite to the organization.

  120. Abbott Says:

    The 20,000 in Ohio is absolutely an exaggeration. According to the Nationwide Arena’s website the entire building can hold “up to 20,000″ for a concert. However, as anyone knows who has attended a team/life Major at an arena (I was at the January one, also in Columbus, and the April one in Milwaukee) they place the stage at one end of the floor which eliminates possible seating for at least 1/3 of the entire arena. They definitely had this stage arrangement at the most recent event as well because I saw a facebook friend’s photo of the event (he will remain unnamed because I know photography is prohibited at these events, probably to prevent people from proving how much they are exaggerating their numbers). Therefore, at the ABSOLUTE MOST, I would conclude they had no more than 14,000 people in attendance. Likely less.

    Sorry to your friend and her husband, Sheryl. Don’t let them fool you as they are being fooled by OW.

  121. switch Says:

    regular guy says-
    “switch-
    you don’t seem to have very many good points.”

    http://www.monavieonthemove.com/malaysia/?p=1588#more-1588

    In case your “team education” is getting in the way of your reading….Please note this important part of MONA VIE’S very own COMPLIANCE ANNOUNCEMENT!!!!!!!

    2.3.8.1. Making unapproved claims about the Product. (Example: cures cancer, diabetes, etc.)

    You jackass…..you should be ashamed of yourself.

  122. webelieved Says:

    Make sure you check out all the companies Orrin and Co. had as well as the ones he listed in other leaders names. Unknown to them what they were for.
    Do we really believe these people are following the Word of God?
    http://amthrax.wordpress.com/2011/11/23/the-many-companies-of-orrin-woodward-chris-brady-and-tim-marks/

  123. Laura Says:

    The man that I live with is a part of Team/Community, now Life. He told me to give him a year and it is now over a year and he is still involved. He tries to get me to read a book or come to a meeting but I refuse saying that I am not into cults and/or brainwashing, which in turns causes an argument. He claims he is doing this for our future (which is getting pretty hard to see). I have asked to see a paystub and/or a W2, still waiting!! He is a divorced father of two with shared equal custody. Might as well say that I have shared custody because his kids are with me more then him as he is away to “promote” the business. As I sit here writing this, he is away on a little vacation at Orrin’s and his daughters are here. In an earlier post I saw that someone wrote that Team teaches how to build relationships and make them stronger, how is that possible when one part of the partnership is never home because there are meetings once or twice a week if not more, monthly all day meetings, and the long weekend meetings? Am I that bullheaded that I don’t see how this is a good thing and think he is being suckered??

  124. Tyler James Archer-Strawn Says:

    Dear Amthrax,

    My name is Tyler James Archer-Strawn. I live in Denver, CO and I am 25 years old. I’m telling you this over the internet because I am honest, but even with the risk of getting hacked or fraud etc… I don’t care, because I have lost everything anyway, and maybe getting the word out will help others. If you can, please put this on your site where many will be able to see it, as I know good and God loving people will definitely see this as a reason to not join TEAM/LIFE.

    About 5 months ago, I went to my friends apartment to attend my first TEAM/LIFE meeting. I was looking for anything to build on, to gain more money and a new life, because living in a one bedroom apartment with 1300 a month is ridiculous. I walked in the door, and sat down for the meeting. Within an hour I had signed up and committed to being a part of TEAM/LIFE. I was so excited. Not to mention, the girl that was presenting, I later fell in love with.

    We attended seminars at my house, at event centers etc. I was so drawn by the promises and faith based business. However after some time I started realizing how fake and materialistic most of these TEAM/LIFE members were. They repeated themselves constantly and talked about “their dreams”, which I can surely say without question, that dreams filled with money and materials are not dreams of God.

    My girl was adamant about team being #1 in her life, and that her dreams mattered more than anything. I was #2. We attended a seminar one night, and the second half cost another $35 to attend, so I was about to leave and we talked before i went, and she stated that right now TEAM/LIFE was her #1 priority. Of course, when you love someone, it would hurt that a business comes before your love. Well, needless to say, she left me later that night over the phone. It broke my heart. But, she still hung around for another week and a half, and you could see it in her eyes. She was trying to figure out if our love or team was more important. She ended up choosing TEAM.

    A week later she came to my house and told me she was pregnant with our child, and I haven’t heard from her since. It’s been 3 months, and I’ve tried going to her dads to talk to her, I’ve even taken $400 to her to help her with the baby. It’s hard not hearing from someone you love, but it’s harder to see them destroy God’s love because of a business, that in itself is fraudulently full of promises.

    This TEAM/LIFE business, it speaks of knowing God and saving marriages and relationships. It tells you to create dreams, based off of things God would never consider holy and loving. Lamborghini’s and houses that are big enough for 10 families, are not gifts of God. They are things that will not matter when zombies are walking down the street, or nuclear bombs are going off 50 miles away. The only things that matter in this world is loving God, and loving each other.

    I know that I’m speaking from a months worth of TEAM/LIFE experience, and I know that my broken heart influences a lot of what I feel about TEAM/LIFE. However, when you look at the outcome of anything that you do in life, anything at all, is it good or is it evil. God or not, the outcome must be good, for everyone. Scamming people to join a business so that you may profit from them and anyone else that joins; is the same as denying a lady a home loan to save her house, so that you can get a promotion. You ever seen drag me to hell? That girl was of a good heart, but she made a horrible decision, and screwed someone else over to get her place in life. Let’s just say she didn’t make it to heaven.

    TEAM/LIFE maybe inspirational, which I highly agree that it is very inspirational, but the overall outcome of what you must do to get to the top… It makes me want to vomit. It spits all over the values that it says they built there business off of. It spits all over everything God has ever taught us, and if you don’t believe in our savior and love, then look into your heart and truly determine if what you are doing is really benefiting others, or just taking there money, while still spending yours.

    TEAM/LIFE is the reason my girl isn’t with me now, and the reason why my baby is probably going to grow up without both parents. Having to go between homes, and love, and faiths. Our baby will grow up knowing that its family didn’t care about it, because TEAM/LIFE came first. I met you at the seminar Chris Brady, and I even told my friend that your suit and hair do, along with your character, made you look like the devil himself. You said something that made my girl chose money over love. For that, I pray to God everyday that you will fall, and live for eternity in your own hell. I never have wished anything like this upon anyone, but these lies and deceptions have taken away everything that really matters to anyone. TEAM/LIFE must be stopped before they corrupt and deceive anyone else. They are not of God as they claim, because God isn’t in the business of having to talk you into something over and over to believe in it.

    - Matthew 6:24
    - “No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money.”

    How can you boast a business on faith, when that same faith says you’re a liar. Now TEAM/LIFE are hypocrites and con artists, just off of one verse.

    I hope my story helps others to realize that this business, is just another business, in the business, of getting into your business. End of story.

  125. Team Scam Says:

    Laura,

    You are right on target. There are a lot of other people in the comments of this post: http://www.juicescam.com/my-experience-with-monavie-and-team/ who feel the way you do. They’ve been there.

    You are also right to bring up the cult and brainwashing… here’s a good article on that: http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4187

    Finally, I recommend you visit Amthrax: http://amthrax.wordpress.com/. Much of it is devoted to Orrin and TEAM.

  126. Stephanie Says:

    I just signed up for this yesterday and am getting out now, as FAST as I can. has anyone experienced identity theft with this? thats the only thing I’m worried about at this point. they have my social. I’m getting the papers back today, but I’m not sure if thats enough.

  127. Team Scam Says:

    Thanks Tyler James Archer-Strawn. That’s a strong story. Sorry that you had to live it.

    Let’s hope your story helps others avoid a similar fate.

  128. Team Scam Says:

    Stephanie,

    Identity theft wouldn’t surprise at this point. (Really nothing would after what I’ve read about this organization.) If you are concerned about identity theft, one of the best things you can do is freeze your credit report.

    Here’s a guide on how to do it: http://redtape.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2007/11/06/6345938-now-a-way-to-stop-id-theft

    There’s a small cost involved, but I’ve known two people who have had their identity stolen and the cost is nominal compared to the consequences.

  129. scam/real/cult Says:

    so, iv been in team for about a month iv spent a bout 250$ on just getting started learning leadership stuff, so far team hasn’t showed me a way to make millions, they seem to talk allot about making money but what they seem to show is only a small % actually make the money and it is by telling people they can make money, having them spend money getting stuck in a idk what to do, spend more money because they are brainwashed into thinking its only because they haven’t used enough of there “tools”. my roommate told me i was in a cult and looked up this site, iv looked at allot of the stories and they seem to match what iv been feeling, so i guess tonight im going to forget all the numbers, names, places, accounts iv been given cut my loses and get out of this scheme, (thankyou teamscam(.)com for en lighting me)

  130. webelieved Says:

    scam/real/cult- Check out John and Melanie
    Morgan’s story. They were good friends with Orrin and got screwed over after like 10 years in team now called LIFE. There is a lot of info and stories on there, be sure to read the life primer there as well.

    http://amthrax.wordpress.com/2011/12/06/a-downlines-perspective-and-request-for-john-and-melanie-morgan/#comments

  131. webelieved Says:

    http://amthrax.wordpress.com/2011/12/06/a-downlines-perspective-and-request-for-john-and-melanie-morgan/

  132. webelieved Says:

    I was wondering if anyone here has been paid from LIFE team?

  133. sheryl Says:

    webelieved Tell we why the numbers are increasing to this cult. Most of my friends in this scam will not talk to me about it. Its like a big secret. I just can’t believe the people from my church are so involved totally against the Bible I spoke to other Pastors of my faith and they say stay away from group I can tell by the way my friends talk they are getting brain washed.So sad.It shows the world is getting desperate for someone to make them feel good. If they would just look at the Bible they would find there answers.I am thinking that Orrin is part of the Anti Christ fooling every one Just tell me how this is happening.

  134. webelieved Says:

    sheryl- The numbers may be increasing, because they use deception to build it. They promise passive, residual, ongoing income. They promise that if you build this business you will get your time back. They also speak so highly of people they idolize and worship them.
    The meetings are a set up. Unknown to the new person, most people in the room have been sitting there for years and are clapping,smiling etc. hoping someday their ship will come in. Most have never made a profit. The group pressure is very powerful. They laugh, you laugh etc. Everyone is taught to never say anything negative about anyone or anything even if it is the truth, especially not in front of the new person. They use what cult experts call love bombing on people, creating instant “friendships” and a feeling of belonging. They will do favors for the prospect in the begining, like drive them to a tuesday meeting, or do a houseplan or help them contact people, than the new person feels they owe them something. (when you leave or stop buying their stuff, almost all won’t even speak to you) In the meantime at the meetings the speaker makes a ton of half true statements, they throw around a bunch of money numbers and dreams a person may like to have.(If the person is shown the business in their home the speaker will look around and use the information to bring out a dream. Let’s say you have fish on the wall, they will talk about fishing. They are taught to ask a lot of questions to steer you towards what your dreams, then they use it to manipulate you to get in. They also will use your personality traits against you.They are trained to recognize personalities. ie: If you are strong headed they will say “this business isn’t for everyone” challenging you and taking the cookie away.) They will Talk about how they are going to change the country and about God. They talk about how team/life has made them a better person. Before the group gets no credit after the group their life is great. They are taught to give the prospect cds that fit their personality or situation specifically, hence they feel oh God must have sent this for me. for instance if you are a plumber they will give you a cd from a plumber. It sounds GREAT on the outside. Then the prospect is told to listen to three or four cds a day and effectively begins to brainwash themselves. Those cds will have stories of others overcoming something and how life/team saved them. This is called confession. The office tells the speakers to only talk about anything that the team has been responsible for helping you with. Don’t say my mom taught me etc. SO people think this is their ticket. THey start talking weird because they are brainwashed or under thought reform.
    They won’t listen to anyone outside the group because they are taught right in the first meeting, if you are not in the group, you will end up dead disabled or broke. You are trading time for money and why would someone take advice from someone who doesn’t have the fruit on the tree?
    They are using the bible to get people in and keep them in. They have a pastor speak at their Major conventions and they give believers cds from pastors! Funny they don’t tell anyone that their own pastor of years,over a decade, Pastor Dickie out of MI left team and Orrin! He was on tons of cds promoting them at one time. That should tell us all something. They also don’t tell you the higher up you go in the heirarchy the more you will be required to conform your personality. Or that you will not have any time with your family if you are really building the business. Or that your mind will be altered. Or that they can take your business whenever they want, for no reason according to their own policies and procedures. That you will have no legal recourse ever and will be tied up by their contract for the rest of your life, even if you quit or they take your money. also in the p&P’s.

    Also passive income is a lie. They took mine without a phone call. They are liars. their contract is disturbing as well and some of their own big leaders filed bankruptcy and had their property in foreclosure only a few months ago. you can find this info under

    http://amthrax.wordpress.com/life-team-primer/

    There are a ton of ex-team/life leaders over there telling their stories. Be sure to read about John and Melanie Morgan. Team really screwed them over.

    Also if you want to help your friends read
    ALL THAT GLITTERS IS NOT GOLD by Athena Dean
    COMBATING CULT MIND CONTROL by Steve Hasan

    I am so glad your pastor is not buying into this lie. From what I have read, Team now LIFE almost destroyed Pastor Dickies church.

    In my opinion, after being involved for years, on stages for years, doing open meetings for years, the whole business is based on half truths, deception, lies and manipulation.

    *The above and other comments posted are all my experiences and opnions from being involved with Team now life and Orrin Woodward and co.

  135. webelieved Says:

    P.s Orrin looks really good on the outside, but the things he has done to the people that have made him a fortune, shows he is evil on the inside. In my opinion of course.

  136. webelieved Says:

    Stephanie- I highly doubt they will steal your identity. They are not into that type of crime and most believe they are Christians. I wouldn’t worry about it. Unless the person who has info is shady outside of team.

  137. webelieved Says:

    Also they will put people into your business to get you in. Telling you if you hold your spot you will have so many people in your business, effectively getting people who say no to say yes. There is a great article explaining this at

    https://amthrax.wordpress.com/2011/03/20/team-sling-squeeze-and-side-action/

    If you only need two teams and one is built for you for a while you will believe. And they know this. that is why they do it.
    But you need to build another one, and what they don’t tell you is the person on the bottom will do most of the work because all the people at the top are building their other leg to make more money. So they are looking for someone to replace them so they can stop working. They also don’t tell you it is a build and replace business, so you will always be working and never get your time back, if you take a break they will steal your business. Ask Mike and Christie Raatz, who just had their business stolen by Tim Marks and Orrin Woodward after years of building, doing seminars etc, because they took a break.

    http://amthrax.wordpress.com/2011/12/06/a-downlines-perspective-and-request-for-john-and-melanie-morgan/#comment-12172

    When your on the bottom you may make a tiny bit but “… the total amount held for less than 1% of everyone involved is an ASTOUNDING 44.3% of all available compensation dollars. Now I may be an idiot, but doesn’t this leave only 55.7% of compensation dollars to be shared between 99% of the rest of the members?…” from a readers Mathematical Analysis of LIFE compensation plan.
    Read more about the numbers at:

    http://amthrax.wordpress.com/2011/11/12/reader-report-figures-dont-lie/

    * all comments are my opinions and experiences of Orrin woodward and team/life.

  138. webelieved Says:

    All that Glitters is not GOD by Athena Dean. Sorry

  139. webelieved Says:

    Sheryl- I would recomend you go to your pastor and give him these sites and iformation. I also would recomend you leave the church if after you inform them and they still allow it and/or stay involved. It could destroy the church eventually. You could have your pastor call Pastor Dickie from Berean Baptist, Grand Blanc MI.

  140. sheryl Says:

    webelieved, I have a question to ask u would u and the others who have been screwed by Orin before this happen did u know this was a cult u belonged to.What about all the people u deceived do u have any remorse for encouraging others
    to join this cult. Just would like to know

  141. Katie *formerly Abbott* Says:

    Sheryl – personally, I never signed anyone up (I was only in TEAM for about 6 months and thankfully no one I showed the plan to joined) so I can’t really speak to that. However, one of the people I did show the plan to accused me of stalking him, accused me of being in a cult and trying to recruit him for his money, and threatened to call the police on me. At the time, I was so incredibly offended by his accusations because I had been brainwashed almost to the point where I really believed TEAM had something to offer that guy, and I was geniunely trying to help him. So, I definitely feel remorse in case ANYONE I ever showed the plan to felt like I was try to take advantage of them or something, because I really never intended it that way… that was the only person who was ever up front about it. He was very rude and offensive about it, but at least he was honest.

    As far as the first part of your question, did I know this was a cult? In a way. From my first Saturday Seminar I thought it was bizarre at best to cheer for people who had signed people up and made money off of them. I thought it was bizarre that they mixed “business” with religion and politics. I thought it was bizarre that they practically idolized Orrin and other PC members like some kind of gods. So… if I had really known how cult-like it was (see #12 here http://amthrax.wordpress.com/life-team-primer/) I would have quit much sooner or never gotten involved in the first place. But it always had a bad feeling about it.

  142. webelieved Says:

    I didn’t know it was a cult.I thought cults chanted and lived together. I was under thought reform and didn’t even know it. You don’t know you are slowly being stripped of your identity, your belief system and your critical thinking abilities. You are being decieved and therefore unfortunately you unknowingly decieve others. Of course I am very remorseful for being a part of it. It disturbs me very much, that is why I am here. To educate and save others the pain I have went through and put others through by trusting the wrong people. It took a long time for the fog to clear. When I first was screwed by Orrin and Co. I had to walk away from promoting the group when who they said they were and who they really were, were two different things. I didn’t understand what had just happened, it felt like being sucker punched or hit from behind. I believed so strongly in Team and then found out it was a lie. It was very painful. I brought people in because I believed I was making a difference and I also believed anyone could make it financially if I did. Of course I couldn’t look at how many people were losing money or why. I was brainwashed to believe people who quit didn’t want to do the work, they didn’t have a dream, etc. Later of course once I was off the koolaid, system, seminars and association i could finally begin to look critically at the shady things the system taught me to do and how i had hurt many others. I actually would’ve never believed it was a cult until I read Combatting Mind control, and I saw how the Moonies heirarchy and control worked, that is when I could see we basically used the same techniques to manipulate people.It was very hard to read. No one could say it was a cult to me as I had been indoctrinated on that comment but I could in my brain make the connection and see the Moonies were a cult. Team actually makes fun of when people say it is a cult and it desensitizes you to it.
    So painful was all of this, losing my income, betrayal of my frineds still in the group, losing my ability to trust others etc. I was slandered by my own team and lied about. It severely affected my physical health and I spent 3 years in a major depression, barely functioning.
    I was terrified to say what they had done to me until a few months back. I still haven’t been able to tell the entire story publically. I have no way of doing any restitution except to tell the truth and warn others with my story.
    I was a victim of deception. They used my trust, my personality, my dreams and my religion to manipulate me and lie to me. I followed them because I trusted them and wanted a better life for my family.

  143. webelieved Says:

    I want to be clear I am talking about Team and Orrin Woodward and Co. not Monavie the company. I have no comment on that.
    All my comments on this blog and above are my opinions and experiences from being on Team and working with Orrin Woodward and/or his leaders.

  144. Katie *formerly Abbott* Says:

    I’m with webelieved… the main reason I leave comments here is to keep other people from falling victim to the same thing. I am still friends with my former sponsor because we work together (at our 9-5 “corporate pyramid” job) and fortunately he is not one of the scummy ones I’ve read about who shuts people out as soon as they quit. I personally think he is also brainwashed so I don’t blame him.

    And as with webelieved, this is my opinion based on my experiences with TEAM/LIFE.

  145. webelieved Says:

    Katie you could give him amthrax site, anonymously. It may help. If he’s really in, he will ostracize you if it comes from you. Or you could give him combatting mind control. But I think Amthrax site would have enough info to crack his critical thinking open, especially John and Melanie Morgan’s story. It is really disturbing.

  146. sheryl Says:

    webelieved, yes this is just about team, I appreciate ur honesty and ur trueth about this also Katie. I can feel ur pain as I read ur note.I am so sorry for this happening to u. God is the only one who can heal this pain, I will hold u in prayer. One of the reason I ask for this as I have more knowledge to fight this when talking to my pastor about his involment in this. I will contact Pastor Dickie I have a spirtually leader who I have talk this about. He is a very Godly man and has been in my life for years He is Hatti atthe moment for the Christmas there and has promised me when he returns he will check this all out for me. My Pastor has been in my life for 30 years my parents and I help pioneer our church when we only had 5 members we are still small. All the knowledge I have the better I can fight these forces of evil.I thank u so much for helping me as I have said before I just can’t believe all the people joing this cult.

  147. webelieved Says:

    What is scary is they use Christianity and leadership principles to get people to believe, all the leaders claim they are Christians. However their actions and demands counteract the faith they claim they have. It is very deceptive. The higher up you go the more you have to conform your behavior and personality to the tyrants’ desires. They demanded me to do what they wanted even unethical, possibly illegal, and definitly un-christian things. They rewarded and or punished me based on my conformity and suspected loyalty to the group. They stole our teams and money and lied over and over again based on my unwillingness to do unethical things. A new recruit will not see any of this as the environment is controled and so is the information, and once one he is all in he cannot see it due to thought reform used on him. When he leaves and recovers than he can reflect back after being educated on how he was decieved. In the middle of it, it is very confusing. You just keep trying and working hard and wondering what is wrong with you that they treat you unfairly. Now I say what is wrong with them that they are such greedy, lying, control freak narcissists!

    *All the above is based on my opinions and experiences from involvment with Orrin Woodward and Co., and Team .

  148. webelieved Says:

    You also think the whole time, this isn’t Orrin, it is my upline so and so, once I get to Orrin he will fix it. Well let me tell you he doesn’t fix anything. He in fact is behind a lot of things. It is really sad when you work your way up to him and you find out he has no empathy for anyone, he only cares to protect his money, and his front men. He doesn’t do the right thing, or enforce any rules that he claims to follow. He lets the criminal behavior go on. He is a liar, and has lied to many, in front of thousands. He is a great con man. A person who says whatever fits the moment at the time. He also is very smart and remembers quotes etc. He uses stories of others for his own credibility. Like George Washington, Winston Churchill, etc.
    If you want to know more check out http://www.amthrax.wordpress.com
    A ton of info over there. An article just came out from a newspaper, Orrin got a loan for 3 million dollars from Monavie, his previous company. He didn’t have to pay it back if he registered a certain amount of distributors or something. Very disturbing. Of course this little tid bit of info was never told to us. He sure was in a hurry to get us registered so much so he didn’t care about the distributors or their businesses, he screwed over a lot of people. No wonder! :(

  149. sheryl Says:

    To webelieved another question I have heard this from two different people in the cult, why do they say not everyone is to be a millionaire it is better to be poor. Of course we know God allows everything to happen for a reason I heard my Pastor say this morning but the way he was prea
    ching I knew what he was saying came from somewhere else also from the Bible Dose some cd teach this. There comments were could u see me as a millionaire.

  150. webelieved Says:

    Sheryl- I am not understanding your question. They use the bible to justify what they are doing and twist it to promote their agenda. Also to stop people’s ability to critically think about the group.
    I would guess there is not as much money available in the Team LIFE plan, so now it is probably being promoted that LIFE is all about the cause and really it is about preying on ones deepest desires.
    Meanwhile,I would guess the top is still raking in all the hundreds of thousands of dollars a month off their downlines. Does that sound like being all about the cause.
    They need to make it not about money now because we are telling the truth of how much it IS about the money.

  151. webelieved Says:

    If it wasn’t about the money why was Orrin taking a half a million dollars a month, while starving his leaders and their families?
    Orrin seems about money to me.

  152. webelieved Says:

    That was reported on amthrax recently by Finally.

  153. sheryl Says:

    webelieved, I am thinking people who don’t sell the juice and just by he cds. My friend said to me when I ask her when she becomes a millionaire to not forget me and she said NOT EVERY ONE IS SUPPOSE TO BE A MILLIONAIRE. then I heard my Pastor say the same thing on Sunday So I thought maybe this is something said on a cd. Just wanted to know if this is something they tell everyone.Also I am unable to find Pastors Dickie phone number or adewss can u provide to me. u can send to my personal E-mail if u like

  154. webelieved Says:

    http://www.allgrace.com/ContactUs/tabid/184/Default.aspx

    Here is Pastor Dickie’s contact info off his church site.
    Team people believe they are making a difference, educating people. They don’t know all the corrupt things their leader has done. They are being decieved by wolves in sheeps clothing in my opinion.

  155. webelieved Says:

    They are being led astray to serve the financial purposes of their uplines. Test it by going off cds books and seminars. These people will push them to the curb when they are not spending their money or doing their bidding.

  156. webelieved Says:

    Have them test it is what I meant to say.

  157. sheryl Says:

    Well my friend are off to the cultmeeting in Ohio she sent me a text telling me they arrived so I sent her a text back with this comment she did not tell me they were going so I thought text was in error ” I don’tthink u meant to send me this text but maybe God wanted u to. U must be late meetings already started HUH any way Iwill pray for and that God deliveres u from this NEW AGE CULT this is not of GOD. Don’t spend to much money on all those TOOLS. Ilove u but hate the DEVILE for tricking U

  158. Steve Says:

    I had a buddy confront me about the new LIFE. Showed up with a brochure and what not. I listened and bombarded him with all kinds of questions, even calling it a pyramid scheme. Anyway he is clearly been listening to to many of these cds and books. The original phone call made it sound like something that would help me pursue my disc golf career. So of course i wanted to hear more. Then he started in about LIFE. He was trying to convince me i need these CD’s and books to better myself, and help others do the same, and make money in the process. HA. Hit me with that quadrant crap, 95/5, etc… Told me to hold my position. I told him I wanted to listen to the CD’s (just to see what this crap was spewing) and that I did NOT need an application and I would meet with him again on monday. I also told him I wanted a complete breakdown on how money worked with this. Anyway as soon as he left I stared in with searching the web on info on this stuff. Found this website. Thanks for all this great info, Someone tried in the past to get me into TEAM or MV or wahtever.

    Monday Im going to take all this information with me to the meeting and bombard him with more! Should be fun.

  159. Team Scam Says:

    Thanks for the comment Steve. I’m glad that this discussion helped.

    I’ve always wanted to give disc golf a shot. I’m going to go out on a limb and presume that TEAM/LIFE doesn’t have any literature to help with your disc golf game ;-).

  160. sheryl Says:

    webelieved, tell me do Pastors receive differnt cds to listen to withthis cult

  161. webelieved Says:

    They can get whatever cds they want.
    When I was in we had a cd series that was called ERM Emmaus Road Ministries, I believe. They were spriritual messages by Pastor Dickie and PC members. Now it is called something different as I hear Pastor Dickie is no longer supporting Team/LIFE.

    ***All of my comments on this site are my opinions from years of experience with Team and Orrin Woodward and company and related others.

  162. webelieved Says:

    Steve- have you read Amthrax’s site?

  163. sheryl Says:

    webelieved, Help me just had a discussion with my friend about LIEF the one that beleives in it she told me I was wrong it is not a Pyrmid and it is not a cult I have it all wrong anyone like Orin who claims Jesus Christ as his savior is not wrong. And it is not motivational cult and she wishes I would just support her and I will never support her. This is just horrible how these people are so fooled HOW do you fight this to make people understand it is a cult IT breaks my heart to stand by and watch this

  164. sheryl Says:

    Guess what the fruit juice is $31 now according to her

  165. withteamlife Says:

    We are with team/ life and the books and cds have made a dramatic change in our outlooks on life. If you are looking for good honest literature to help you or just want to learn how to better yourself I suggest you read a book or two, or listen to some cds .. It is not a cult, there are no mandatory rules you need to follow, you can do as you wish with the products you buy .. And team/ life is not ALL about some stupid fruit juice .. I honestly don’t even know what kind of fruit juice your talking about.

  166. Team Scam Says:

    There are plenty of helpful books and CDs to get at the library. If you want to own them, they are cheaper on Amazon.com. Here’s a great list: http://personalmba.com/best-business-books/.

    If you don’t know about the fruit juice that TEAM was involved with just a couple of months ago, you really didn’t do your research on TEAM.

  167. webelieved Says:

    Withteamlife- Did you know Orrin started with Amway, than sold Team Leadership, than Monavie, than LIFE. They are an Amway motivational Organization.

  168. switch Says:

    withteamlife says-
    “I honestly don’t even know what kind of fruit juice your talking about.”

    It’s like one after the other, isn’t it folks? They jump from one multi-level marketing company to the next and on top of that, the newbies have no clue what they’ve gotten themselves into. That’s beautiful team-LIEFERS!

    First it was…”We were never associated with Amway” then it was….”Quixtar, what is that?”…and now last but not least…”I have no clue what fruit juice you’re talking about”???!!!

    LMAO!…my LORD, what’s next team?

  169. sheryl Says:

    Get real these people know what the fruit juice is. Just because they are not pushing it at this time some in there cult class is drinking this juice. Sounds like you are trying to scam us here. Won.t happen these folks are to smart. Go back and read all your prescribed books, and listen to all your brain washing CDS. worship your Anti christ Orin,and be controlled by all this BS.Don,t forget Jonestown going on right here in the good old USA control, control be sure to listen to your cds every waking hour.so you can be controled

  170. Aaron Says:

    you people are pretty dumb, i bet you all just got involved with team at what ever stage they were in (amyway/quixtar, monavie) and just didnt have what it takes to be successful in this business. Those who blame their upline/ downline in these posts clearly dont understand how the business is built and its pretty sad because the information provides you with the answers to build the business. they don’t brainwash you like the tv or other social media does. The team pc founded life because they saw a decline in our society. too many people are comfortable with just getting by or living their own mediocre life and that is exactly why other countries are whopping us financially. If you choose to do nothing to change that, its your decision Team and Life are going to continue to make a difference in peoples lives but only if the people want it to. Like I said before clearly all you people dont have what it takes to be successful. So instead of bashing someone who is actually doing something productive and enhancing not only others lives but North America, so that people like you can have it easy and live a comfortable life free of the troubles other nations literally kill for, you should be thanking orrin and the team pc for doing what it takes to bring North America back to what it was when the founding fathers dreamed of living in freedom.

  171. Fortune40 Says:

    I am a senior manager with a fortune 40 company as well as a TEAM member. I would like to share my personal experience with you. I joined TEAM (6 months ago) for several reasons, one was to work on a retirement (since my 401k wasn’t performing). The other reason, was because I wanted something more out of life. When you look at an organization like TEAM (and the new LIFE business), the quality of materials cannot be denied. Lets forget compensation for a moment. What company will help you get information on having a better marriage, improve parenting skills, grow in your spiritual walk, and help to truly make a difference in your community? Mark Twain said “If you find yourself agreeing with the majority, step back and reflect”. I hope this helps those who are exploring TEAM and LIFE. I promise you, there is nothing more noble than what this company represents. You can go with the flow, or purpose to make changes that will benefit you and your family. Good Luck!
    P.S.
    Check out All Grace Outreach, and see the battered women & children shelters that are financially benefiting from TEAM/LIFE. Those of you that are falsely attacking TEAM should think twice, these charities need us….and you!

  172. Team Scam Says:

    Aaron,

    Didn’t you know that losing money isn’t a matter of effort, it’s a mathematical certainty. There is only one thing that is proven to be successful in MLM, know the people who are starting it and get in early at the top. When you look at the people who are successful in MonaVie they are the ones that came from Amway and brought their line over… they aren’t the people who showed MonaVie business plans.

    Yes, people shouldn’t blame their uplines or downlines, because they aren’t relevant. It is the compensation plan that should be blamed.

    As for brainwashing, it should be mentioned that Freedom of Mind highlights the brainwashing techniques of Amway. Skeptoid has a handbook for what to do when a friend is brainwashed by MLM. TV or Social Media never told anyone to ignore their friends’ and family’s advice as they may be “dream stealers” like MLM companies.

    TEAM and LIFE was started to make Orrin Woodward money. Read this article: http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2008/0811/050.html. There’s nothing wrong with making money, but when Forbes calls you a pyramid scheme, which is illegal, it’s not a good sign. There are plenty of people who want to people be successful. Go pick up a Dale Carnegie book from the library for one example. Look into http://personalmba.com/ for another. Don’t trick yourself into getting involved in a pyramid scheme by thinking that it is a path to success. Look where Bernie Madoff is now with his pyramid scheme.

  173. sheryl Says:

    WOW, sounds like he is ANTI GOVERMENT Seems like he came on here not to learn but to slam us.Guess he will join the Jones town of America.Tell us when you get rich,On this site there is truth and the truth will set you free. The problem with Americans like him they want something for nothing.He should read All that Glitter is not GOD, which I did at this sites recommendation GREAT read I learned alot from it and how this MLM get into the church.If every one is so proud that they belong to this CULT then stop hiding behind close doors in secret meetings and pretending it is christian meeting that God is there. I doubt Jesus would live his life like this, and we should be christ like

  174. switch Says:

    Aaron Says-
    “you people are pretty dumb, i bet you all just got involved with team at what ever stage they were in (amyway/quixtar, monavie) and just didnt have what it takes to be successful in this business.”

    Seriously Aaron? That’s the god most idiotic statement I’ve heard coming from a team/lifer. “What it takes” is, a lying BASTARD to keep it going.

    Question though,…. Will you say the same about the new LIFE system once that’s old school too?

  175. Team Scam Says:

    Fortune40,

    Why do you announce that you are a senior manager with a Fortune 40 company? Without a name and proof, it doesn’t mean anything. You don’t see me bragging about being an advisor to Obama (oops). The point is that if you aren’t going to prove it, don’t claim it.

    I commend you for looking out for your financial future. That’s a good move. I know what you are saying about 401k plans not performing. That said, there’s no financial reason to get involved in TEAM. If you read http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2008/0811/050.html, it shows how people are taking on debt. If you read some of the comments above you’ll see that most people are losing money. Some of the people who should be making money have found themselves cut off by Orrin when they reach significant levels. You are wise to say, “Let’s forget about compensation for a moment” because that’s the scam.

    Fortune40 said,

    “What company will help you get information on having a better marriage, improve parenting skills, grow in your spiritual walk, and help to truly make a difference in your community?”

    You want a company that give you all that. It’s Amazon.com and the books are much cheaper. If you don’t want to pay for it, I’ve got a solution for that too. It’s called the library. All the information you need is there. As for making a difference in your community, I suppose you can put all the money lost in TEAM and the broken marriages making a difference. If you are looking for a positive difference, again, support your local library.

    Fortune40 said,

    “Mark Twain said ‘If you find yourself agreeing with the majority, step back and reflect’.”

    With apologies to Mark Twain, if the majority says that I shouldn’t jump off a bridge, I’m not going to take too much time considering the benefits of jumping off a bridge. When Forbes says it is a pyramid scheme, take a step back and reflect on why you’d want to get involved in something illegal like that?

    It looks like All Grace Outreach is a religious organization. It’s sad that we can’t have a charity that just helps people regardless of their religion without shoving their religion in their face. Remember that TEAM partnered with MonaVie for years and did nothing to stop the MORE Project which was shown to be a sham of a charity. It wouldn’t surprise me if All Grace Outreach was the same. (I’m not saying it is, but I’m just saying that it wouldn’t surprise me.)

    Even if All Grace Outreach is on the level, swindling people of millions and giving a small amount of it back to charity as a public relations move is disgraceful. Do some math and see how much charity could be done if all the people just dropped the TEAM scam and donated that money to charity.

  176. Whatever... Says:

    You don’t have to buy MonaVie anymore.. you don’t receve Points/Money from them anymore, thats why you don’t see anything about it anymore.. but it is still under one of the 8 Fs (Fitness).. Maybe the Team LIFE business didn’t work for you but it is working for others.. there must have been something wrong with the way you were doing things. Stop wasting time thinking about the problems, and find a solution…. grow up

    (This is to no one specificly)

  177. Team Scam Says:

    Yeah, you don’t have to buy MonaVie anymore because MonaVie decided they wanted to sell their own tools and make money that way. Let’s not forget that it’s well-known that MonaVie paid Orrin Woodward 3 million dollars to bring the TEAM people over from Amway.

    The problem is with TEAM and most other MLMs. It’s been documented and proven dozens of times that it is the system. Stop lying to yourself and others and putting it on people.

    It’s like blaming people for not being starting shortshop for the Yankees. Hey, there can only be one. An athletic person can put in 30,000 hours of practice and still not be good enough to get the position. We don’t blame that person for not trying hard enough, we recognize that the system doesn’t allow for everyone to be successful. For more on this read: http://www.juicescam.com/its-not-a-matter-of-effort-its-a-mathematical-certainty/.

  178. In Clear Print Says:

    In their FAQ page TEAM uses terms like “utilizes materials”, and “buys into the culture”, also stated that “is loosely considered”

    In short IF you buy into what they are selling you they might include you in their scam….

    Its all right there in black and white!!

  179. JM Says:

    I was involved in Team for a short while and then in the “LIFE Business” shortly after is started up. I will say that SOME of the info in the books and cd’s is quality, helpful info. However, the whole LIFE bit WILL drain your money. It took me just a few months to realize this. Not to mention, it is hard to make much money from it. An distant friend of mine got me into it, stating that with us all working together, I should easily be able to quit my job within a year or so. This person happened to be one of the leaders in the local LIFE group. After a little while, I began to realize that I was spending quite a bit of money in this “business”, and not really getting much in return. I had an open mind, but began to see the bigger picture. Certain things began to surface the longer I was involved. Things that I wasn’t originally told about, such as the details of the income part and the customer requirements required to continue to get payment. I also was later told that it would be more realistic that it might take more like 5-6 years before I could quit my job, not within the 1 year like I had been told previously. I realized that between the required monthly subscription, weekly meetings that also cost, and the seminars and out-of-state conventions, I would soon be dishing out THOUSANDS of dollars in just a few years. It was at that time, that I quickly got out of the whole thing. Shortly after, I found out that two others in my group had also quit, apparently realizing that it was indeed a money racket as well. I am all for improving myself, but not at such a cost. Please consider staying away from the LIFE Team!

  180. webelieved Says:

    Jm and clear print- Thanks for the input. Have you read amthrax’s site? Lot’s of Team info there too!

  181. sheryl Says:

    Guess it must be Meeting time again everybody off to waste there money on New Age religion and get there minds filled with false teachings. They all must be doing good have a lot on money to waste on false teaching. Just sounding off Makes me sick to know my friends are wasting there lifes for a lie. This Orin dude must be one powerful guy to fool so many folks. ( just sounding off people)

  182. Gordon Freeman Says:

    When Forbes calls you out for being a money-grubbing schemer, you know you’ve crossed a line.

  183. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Gordon Freeman~

    True… along with all the first hand testimonies about these corrupt scammers.

    JM~ That is the MO of the LIEfers… intentionally leaving out the rest of the story!Glad to see you recognized it!

    Sheryl~

    “This Orin dude must be one powerful guy to fool so many folks.”

    He isn’t that powerful but has practiced ‘fooling’(undue influencing) people for 2 decades; which he began in Amway.

  184. M.S. Says:

    My parents have both been in Team since 2008 and have steadily gotten more and more immersed into the lifestyle. At first, I was concerned of course, but slowly they got me to start believing that this was a good way to earn money and be financially secure. We had a lot of debts and were pretty much a lower middle class family, so it’s understandable why something like this would be appealing. Both my sister and I thought we should go ahead and join Team some time after we got done with college.

    To the Team’s credit, the speakers influences and the books they started reading really started to change my parents for the better and gave them a more positive outlook on life. I went to several seminars and majors with them, but I couldn’t afford to go to many, so they would sometimes pay for my tickets.

    The Team started to have less appeal to me when I was around 20, when I became an atheist. Primarily because of the blatantly Christian messages they projected. Even after my parens fount out I was no loner a Christian, they proposed that “you don’t need to be a Christian to be part of Team.” And for the most part, I would agree.

    However, it wasn’t until after revoking religion did I see how much Team had been immersing Christianity and a Christian messages into what they teach. For as long as I’ve gone to seminars, they would always open with a prayer, making sure to thank Jesus. Leaders would quote the bible and every sunday morning at majors they would have sunday services, FOR CHRISTIANS. And now that LIFE has come out, they put even more emphasis on one of “the eight F’s of LIFE”… faith. And not just religious faith, or spiritual faith. Faith in Christianity, the Bible, and Jesus. You may not have to be a Christian to be in Team, but they do emphasize -heavily- on “Christian and biblical values.”

    I can’t begin to tell you how many times I’ve heard someone on those LIFE: Faith CDs talk about how somene like me is “spiritually dishonst” and how the Christian message is not only the best way to go, it’s the only way. This, to me, shows intellectual dishonesty and a fundamental ignorance of culture, logic, and the human phenomena known as religion. But, I won’t get into an argumen of theology here.

    The Team seens very Evangelical to me now. They believe themselves to be -the- future moral leaders of the country, and I’m quite sure they believe America is a Christian nation and should be lead by people that follow their philosophy. You know, even though it’s suppose to be a secular country. And don’t even get me started on the hypocrisy. I’ve heard on many CDs how they put down science as a basically useless practice, but then talk about the science of the Acai berry and how many neurons are stimulated in the brain for a conscious and unconscious thought.

    Needless to say, because of the Team’s influence on my parents, they have become very devout in their religion. I don’t particularly care if someone is devoted to their religion and for the most part I’m fine with the live and let live philosophy. But I fear that total immersion will only skew their sense of reality. Team and Christianity are basically one in the sam to them now.

    As for the actul system and the way Team makes money, I don’t feel I’m qualified to give my analysis, since I still largely don’t understand it. I will say that they have gained enough of a monthly check from Team that we were able to move to a better house and my mom will be able to retire from her job soon, but I can’t help but question where that money really comes from. How much have they spent on books, CDs, and major and seminar tickets over the past four years. I often wonder if they ask themselves these questions, or if they continue to run blindly without questioning.

    Recently, I have informed them that I don’t want them to ask me to go to another seminar again. I want little to nothing to do with Team. We still have a great relationship and I’m still living with them until I can earn enough money to move to Japan for school, so any complaints and criticisms over the Team I have I feel must be kept to myself. I don’t want these growing differences to get in the way of our relationships, but it’s hard when the people you know and love seemed to be getting more and more deluted.

    Yes, I realize most of my problems with Team have to do with the religious aspect of it, but I would imagine even someone of the same faith would be able to recognize the dishonesty, hypocricy, and blind delusion that’s practiced in this buisness. Even my sister is hesitant and questions whether she wants to let this become her whole life.

  185. sheryl Says:

    Friends off to cult meeting sure dont understand how they can afford it but in time I truley hope they fall on there face then maybe they will wake up

  186. Steven Says:

    Sounds to me cult like, they say things like “when you came into the truth” just like another cult I know (Seventh Day Adventist) who always talked about how you came into the truth after you were recruited.

    I can’t understand what they are selling, I haven’t joined but I think you can get all theself help for free off of the internet, Google & you Tube.

  187. norcal kid Says:

    Thanks all for your comments & insight. An old friend suckered me in to the LIFE/TEAM and, despite an original bad feeling about it: I stuck around for a couple weeks; I signed up at an open meeting and went to a seminar; and almost started the ‘contacting’ of others to sell them on it. That’s also when the cult aspect really showed itself. I’ve since acted on my 30-day opt-out and cut my losses.

    I worry for my friend though, as they have brain-washed her and are isolating her in their insular “community.” She wouldn’t let up with the pressure to do more, attend more, and ultimately sell more, blinded by the hope for easy riches. I kept telling her I couldn’t get involved for lack of time (I’m working two jobs AND going to school), but she wouldn’t relent. I “only need to listen to 4 CD’s a day”…! It’s my fault for letting my guard down and not sticking with my original ‘no’; but at least I got out before being in too deep.

    It wasn’t as though I didn’t already know, about pyramids, either. When I was younger some friends of mine got into Amway (for about 5 mins.) and then all dropped out. It was the same ‘carrot’ of blatant consumerism. Years later Scientologists offered ‘free personality profiles’ while I was strolling through Central Park in NYC. They prey upon any ‘weaknesses’ that reveal themselves in the tests, and try to sell you on Scientology. (good luck getting off their mailing lists…) Calling it an “MLM” that is “perfectly legal” is just repackaging old poison in a fancy new bottle.

    It struck me that the slick thing about LIFE–with the effect multiplied through the bad economy now, and continued general public desperation–is that they tap into people’s dreams {their ‘BHAG’} and tamper with them. Most effective in this regard was a CD set on Following your Dreams and “The Ant and the Elephant.” They recognize the power of the subconscious mind and tap into it for their own purposes. It isn’t just that they encourage people to go after their own personal dreams and goals, and give tools for disciplining oneself to that end. It is harnessing the drive to do that IN ORDER TO BENEFIT THE TEAM/LIFE LEADERS AND THEIR BUSINESS! Wow, that was a real wake-up call in manipulation.

    I realized how ridiculous–albeit effective–it is to sell people on their own dreams! It is a way of controlling people, if they surrender to the program as a means to get there.

    Fancy CD cases and logos won’t cover over the fact that much of their material is borrowed from sources that can be obtained elsewhere for less…and likely be in a more correct form. (i.e., why not get a copy of Thomas Paine from the library if you want to really learn what he really said?)
    Mis-quoting Benjamin Franklin or Thomas Jefferson and mouthing other far-out, right-wing political tenets notwithstanding…what they’re selling is not merely snake-oil. What they’re doing is meddling with your mind and your dreams.

    Run. Run fast; run far. Take back your life from TEAM/LIFE; I hope my friend does before it’s too late.

  188. Bonnie Brado Says:

    Ill tell all of you people something that were campers and quitters which is the reason why you didnt make any money……. Chris Brady, Orrin woodward, tim marks and the rest of the founders f team life have changed my life!!! Pure and simple! Your disbelief will never and could never outweigh my belief!!!!! Stop bashing good people that are changing the world one winner at a time!

  189. webelieved Says:

    If you really love your parents I would recommend reading Combatting Cult Mind Control and see what you think. If you think it is destructive then you can take action, if not then you can let it go. Just an idea.Good luck!

  190. RAQUEL PETERS Says:

    Teamscam, just wanted to say I LOVE your site! The story Amthrax has posted about our time in Team/Team MV is VERY accurate. Since Team leaders like to call critics of their business faceless, nameless, cowards, haters and quitters, I decided to link my face and my name to our story on my Facebook page. We can let the readers decide what and who they chose to believe. I believe many people are being lied to, so I have posted my Team profit sharing pay, my system counts, my speaking pay and my experiences and opinions about the way we were treated while we were involved in this group and after we left.

    Feel free to copy and share this link with anyone you like! I am very encouraged to see your readers speaking out to help inform others. Keep up the good fight. Happy reading! :)

    “Is Orrin Woodward’s Life/Team business destructive?”

    http://www.facebook.com/#!/lifeteamdestructive

    If anyone would like to speak directly to me, send me a message on the page.

    It is important for me to note: Eric Blomdahl’s article “Criticism” is packed FULL of slanderous lies and the commentators do not know me personally and/or have not spent any length of time getting to know me personally. As Christians they have no business passing judgment on my heart, my motives, my character or anything else!
    To Woodward, Guzzardo, Hawkins, Blomdahl and the rest…………keep lying about us it really shows your character…….or lack there of!
    Raquel Peters- former Round Table with TEAM.

  191. Renee Says:

    Can anyone help? My husband was approached by a guy he works with to check out LIFE.. Keep in mind my husband is easily influenced by others & is always trying to make more money. After going to co-workers house & listening to speech he decided I should hear it for myself. He invites the guy that gives speech over & I listen. All 3 of these guys are military including guy giving speech & he tells me this LIFE is mostly military signing up so you know you can’t go wrong. When he finished giving me the spill he asked if he could sign us up. I say no its Christmas time we have 2 kids not a good time, besides I’d like to do my own research before agreeing. This made him uncomfortable & he says I can send you all the info you need. I still say no I want to research it on my own. He proceeded to ask what we were doing that weekend, I told him we were busy, our daughter had a performance. He actually had nerve to ask if we would miss it to attend a thing with him. That really set me off but my husband was blind to it all. Finally when he wasn’t getting a yes he offered to front the money to get us started & after Christmas pay him back. I still say no way. Finally he leaves I do research & I find more negative than good. I discuss it with my husband & we agreed it was a no. My husband was still convinced thanks to co worker so he waited until after Christmas & went behind my back to sign up. Needless to say I’m not happy about it. With that said can anyone provide me with info that proves this is a scam. As much as I’d love stories on your experience this isn’t going to sell with my gullible husband. I need facts, although even with facts I may not be able to get him to listen to me. Any advice?? Thank you

  192. Cathy B Says:

    Funny how MS says that all good things are happening in her parents lives and they have changed for the better and her mother will retire soon and they are making more money and bought a nicer house and gets along great with them but she thinks it is not right because she became an atheist and they are not catering to her disbelief. Honey, maybe it is time to realize that Jesus loves you and if all these good things happen to those who follow him than maybe he is real! I am not involved in this, just checking it out, but I do think you should give Christianity another chance… looks like it is working out pretty well for those you love.

  193. Team Scam Says:

    Thanks for the comment, Ms. Peters. Sorry that I didn’t publish it before now. I’ve kind of moved on from exposing Orrin’s scam, because I think it’s pretty well known by now.

 
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